Loss of friends

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Re: Loss of friends

Post by Doctor X » Sat Jan 20, 2018 4:49 pm

I will not buy this record.

It is scratched.

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Re: Loss of friends

Post by Papa Lazarou » Sat Jan 20, 2018 5:13 pm

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Re: Loss of friends

Post by Doctor X » Sat Jan 20, 2018 5:31 pm

I think there is a block in my toilet.

--J.D.
Mob of the Mean: Free beanie, cattle-prod and Charley Fan Club!
"Doctor X is just treating you the way he treats everyone--as subhuman crap too dumb to breathe in after you breathe out."--Don
DocX: FTW.--sparks
"Doctor X wins again."--Pyrrho
"Never sorry to make a racist Fucktard cry."--His Humble MagNIfIcence
"It was the criticisms of Doc X, actually, that let me see more clearly how far the hypocrisy had gone."--clarsct
"I'd leave it up to Doctor X who has been a benevolent tyrant so far."--Grammatron
"Indeed you are a river to your people.
Shit. That's going to end up in your sig."--Pyrrho
"Try a twelve step program and accept Doctor X as your High Power."--asthmatic camel
"just like Doc X said." --gnome

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Re: Loss of friends

Post by gnome » Sat Jan 20, 2018 6:07 pm

WildCat wrote:
gnome wrote:I think you're not getting it quite right.

https://www.snopes.com/obama-encouraged ... s-to-vote/

"Rodriguez’s question seems to be addressing a fear that voting will result in scrutiny on one’s family which could result in deportation of undocumented relatives."

This could be a legitimate fear even if the person voting is a citizen voting lawfully.

That's reinforced by his response... his words presume that the person voting is a citizen, and their family member is their concern.
OBAMA: Not true. And the reason is, first of all, when you vote, you are a citizen yourself. And there is not a situation where the voting rolls somehow are transferred over and people start investigating, et cetera. The sanctity of the vote is strictly confidential in terms of who you voted for. If you have a family member who maybe is undocumented, then you have an even greater reason to vote.
I'm not buying that at all. She specifically asked about "dreamers" and "undocumented citizens" voting. Neither of which can vote, and Obama said nothing to that effect.
Her question was phrased oddly, yes. And I think Obama did say something to that effect when he specified that voting would be done by citizens.
"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight! Sun Tzu said that, and I'd say he knows a little bit more about fighting than you do, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living man could best him in the ring of honor. Then, he used his fight money to buy two of every animal on earth, and then he herded them onto a boat, and then he beat the crap out of every single one. And from that day forward any time a bunch of animals are together in one place it's called a zoo! (Beat) Unless it's a farm!"
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Re: Loss of friends

Post by WildCat » Sat Jan 20, 2018 6:19 pm

gnome wrote:Her question was phrased oddly, yes. And I think Obama did say something to that effect when he specified that voting would be done by citizens.
No, Obama seemed to say voting made you a citizen. Also she asked about "undocumented citizens" voting.

Why do people even question that illegals vote when there are no systems in place to stop them from doing it? Is it reasonable to expect people who get fake SS cards and IDs would be stopped from voting by their own sense of morality?

It's like opening a store that works on an honor system, with signs proclaiming "No security cameras or personnel on site, and we don't even do any accounting" and expecting people not to steal.
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Re: Loss of friends

Post by gnome » Sat Jan 20, 2018 6:23 pm

I'm not questioning if illegals ever vote unlawfully. I'm questioning the scale.

And do you think that Obama actually intended to claim voting made you a citizen, or was it an ambiguous word choice that you're determined to play gotcha with?
"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight! Sun Tzu said that, and I'd say he knows a little bit more about fighting than you do, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living man could best him in the ring of honor. Then, he used his fight money to buy two of every animal on earth, and then he herded them onto a boat, and then he beat the crap out of every single one. And from that day forward any time a bunch of animals are together in one place it's called a zoo! (Beat) Unless it's a farm!"
--Soldier, TF2

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Re: Loss of friends

Post by WildCat » Sat Jan 20, 2018 6:44 pm

gnome wrote:I'm not questioning if illegals ever vote unlawfully. I'm questioning the scale.

And do you think that Obama actually intended to claim voting made you a citizen, or was it an ambiguous word choice that you're determined to play gotcha with?
I think it was an intentionally ambiguous choice of words. She knew what she was asking, and he knew how to string her along. Democrats have been doing this for years, they don't directly tell illegals to vote but they always make sure that no systems are put in place to keep them from voting and are vociferous in that endeavor.
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Re: Loss of friends

Post by shuize » Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:30 pm

I haven't lived in California for a very long time, but my father says illegal immigrants can now get driver's licenses there.

Checking the California online voter registration (also conveniently available in Spanish), the first question asks about citizenship. So there is that. Clicking some version of "yes" brings one to the next page which asks for personal information, name, address, driver's license, social security information, etc. Interestingly, below "Driver's License" and "Social Security Number" there are boxes for "I don't have a driver's license" and "I don't have a social security number."

I didn't go any further in the registration process, but the way the cite is organized suggests one could register to vote by falsely claiming citizenship and using a driver's license in place of a social security number. All from the convenience of one's living room.

http://www.sos.ca.gov/elections/voter-registration/

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Re: Loss of friends

Post by Doctor X » Sun Jan 21, 2018 5:52 am

Thanks Obama!

--J.D.
Mob of the Mean: Free beanie, cattle-prod and Charley Fan Club!
"Doctor X is just treating you the way he treats everyone--as subhuman crap too dumb to breathe in after you breathe out."--Don
DocX: FTW.--sparks
"Doctor X wins again."--Pyrrho
"Never sorry to make a racist Fucktard cry."--His Humble MagNIfIcence
"It was the criticisms of Doc X, actually, that let me see more clearly how far the hypocrisy had gone."--clarsct
"I'd leave it up to Doctor X who has been a benevolent tyrant so far."--Grammatron
"Indeed you are a river to your people.
Shit. That's going to end up in your sig."--Pyrrho
"Try a twelve step program and accept Doctor X as your High Power."--asthmatic camel
"just like Doc X said." --gnome

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Re: Loss of friends

Post by gnome » Sun Jan 21, 2018 7:00 am

It is claimed in this article that the licenses cannot be used for federal identification.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/california ... mmigrants/

This article seems to confirm that in the context of registering to vote.

https://www.ocregister.com/2017/01/26/h ... bly-didnt/
"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight! Sun Tzu said that, and I'd say he knows a little bit more about fighting than you do, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living man could best him in the ring of honor. Then, he used his fight money to buy two of every animal on earth, and then he herded them onto a boat, and then he beat the crap out of every single one. And from that day forward any time a bunch of animals are together in one place it's called a zoo! (Beat) Unless it's a farm!"
--Soldier, TF2

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Re: Loss of friends

Post by Doctor X » Sun Jan 21, 2018 8:02 am

My hovercraft is filled with eels.

--J.D.
Mob of the Mean: Free beanie, cattle-prod and Charley Fan Club!
"Doctor X is just treating you the way he treats everyone--as subhuman crap too dumb to breathe in after you breathe out."--Don
DocX: FTW.--sparks
"Doctor X wins again."--Pyrrho
"Never sorry to make a racist Fucktard cry."--His Humble MagNIfIcence
"It was the criticisms of Doc X, actually, that let me see more clearly how far the hypocrisy had gone."--clarsct
"I'd leave it up to Doctor X who has been a benevolent tyrant so far."--Grammatron
"Indeed you are a river to your people.
Shit. That's going to end up in your sig."--Pyrrho
"Try a twelve step program and accept Doctor X as your High Power."--asthmatic camel
"just like Doc X said." --gnome

WS CHAMPIONS X3!!! NBA CHAMPIONS!! Stanley Cup! SB CHAMPIONS X5!!!!!
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Re: Loss of friends

Post by RCC: Act II » Mon Jan 22, 2018 1:46 pm

gnome wrote:I'm not questioning if illegals ever vote unlawfully. I'm questioning the scale.
Yeah, either there is a massive organized plot, or illegal and legal non-citizen residents are on their own falsely registering to vote in massive numbers.

The former would require a mass conspiracy of which there is zero evidence whatsoever beyond tinfoil hat logic. Plus, if the dems were able to commit fraud on such a scale why even bring actual people into it? This is the least efficient way possible to commit massive voter fraud.

Beyond the lack of evidence, the latter ignores that the risk/reward of such an act is so far skewed towards risk that it is absurd. A legal resident would face losing possible citizenship, and an illegal resident would call attention to him or herself.

Plus, there is no guarantee that these people will vote in a certain way anyway.

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Re: Loss of friends

Post by gnome » Mon Jan 22, 2018 1:55 pm

WildCat wrote:but they always make sure that no systems are put in place to keep them from voting and are vociferous in that endeavor.
I tend to question the bolded part. To my understanding most debate is over the sufficiency and appropriateness of various measures, not the existence. The scale of any potential fraud is quite relevant to how strict the measures need to be, especially when increasing strictness begins to interfere with lawful voting. (or, as in some cases, is specifically racially targeted, as found in court)
"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight! Sun Tzu said that, and I'd say he knows a little bit more about fighting than you do, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living man could best him in the ring of honor. Then, he used his fight money to buy two of every animal on earth, and then he herded them onto a boat, and then he beat the crap out of every single one. And from that day forward any time a bunch of animals are together in one place it's called a zoo! (Beat) Unless it's a farm!"
--Soldier, TF2

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Re: Loss of friends

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Mon Jan 22, 2018 2:07 pm

RCC: Act II wrote: The former would require a mass conspiracy of which there is zero evidence whatsoever ...
We're not talking about some massive registration drive targeting illegals.

The deal is merely to accept any filled out registration form uncritically.
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Re: Loss of friends

Post by gnome » Mon Jan 22, 2018 2:47 pm

Unless the article I posted from ocregister is inaccurate--for example in California they match registration forms against DMV records. (with the provisional licenses available to undocumented immigrants specifically excluded from approval).

So that means there is at least some systemic vetting there. Is there a more comprehensive description of how registrations are approved somewhere? That is only one example.

Also, that still swings it towards RCC's second category.
"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight! Sun Tzu said that, and I'd say he knows a little bit more about fighting than you do, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living man could best him in the ring of honor. Then, he used his fight money to buy two of every animal on earth, and then he herded them onto a boat, and then he beat the crap out of every single one. And from that day forward any time a bunch of animals are together in one place it's called a zoo! (Beat) Unless it's a farm!"
--Soldier, TF2

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Re: Loss of friends

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Mon Jan 22, 2018 3:15 pm

gnome wrote:Unless the article I posted from ocregister is inaccurate--for example in California they match registration forms against DMV records. ...
But what do the check when you get a driver's license?

In Illinois you need some proof of address.

When you pay for the license after waiting in various lines + an eye test, they ask you if you want to register to vote.
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Re: Loss of friends

Post by gnome » Mon Jan 22, 2018 3:24 pm

According to this guide there is a proof of residency requirement.

https://www.dmv.org/ca-california/apply-license.php
"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight! Sun Tzu said that, and I'd say he knows a little bit more about fighting than you do, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living man could best him in the ring of honor. Then, he used his fight money to buy two of every animal on earth, and then he herded them onto a boat, and then he beat the crap out of every single one. And from that day forward any time a bunch of animals are together in one place it's called a zoo! (Beat) Unless it's a farm!"
--Soldier, TF2

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Re: Loss of friends

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Mon Jan 22, 2018 3:29 pm

gnome wrote:According to this guide there is a proof of residency requirement.

https://www.dmv.org/ca-california/apply-license.php
You mean a bill with your name and address?
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Re: Loss of friends

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Mon Jan 22, 2018 3:30 pm

"Illegal alien" == resident.

QED
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Re: Loss of friends

Post by Nyarlathotep » Mon Jan 22, 2018 4:30 pm

I still work in the field of voter registration, for about two more weeks. The AB-60 drivers license, the one that illegals would get in California, is not considered a valid form of ID for any purpose other than being allowed to drive. That's baked right into the law that created it. Therefore, one cannot register to vote with an AB-60. Can't register with it, can't buy a beer with it, can only drive with it.

And yes, they match registration forms against DLs (and/or state issued ID). The only way someone is registering with an AB-60 is if someone checked the wrong box when entering them into the system
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