Electric truck

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ed
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Re: Electric truck

Post by ed » Wed Oct 04, 2017 9:54 pm

Rob Lister wrote:
gnome wrote:Battery swap stations? No charging delay, just give the "station" the old battery, grab a freshly charged one (or have a robot replace it unless there's a union issue). Pay the fee which is part energy cost and partly battery replacement costs when they are retired by the stations because they're getting a little dodgy.
Yep. Now think of the logistics. How pretty are they? In the end is it cheaper than diesel?
Think of the logistics involved with fedex before it worked. Woulda been thought impossible ...

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Re: Electric truck

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Wed Oct 04, 2017 10:09 pm

I want Doctor No Face back already. :evil:
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Re: Electric truck

Post by Rob Lister » Wed Oct 04, 2017 10:19 pm

ed wrote:
gnome wrote:Battery swap stations? No charging delay, just give the "station" the old battery, grab a freshly charged one (or have a robot replace it unless there's a union issue). Pay the fee which is part energy cost and partly battery replacement costs when they are retired by the stations because they're getting a little dodgy.
Thank you. Please explain the concept to Rob. Use small words and lots of gestures.
Please don't use racist gestures like ed likes.

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Re: Electric truck

Post by Rob Lister » Fri Mar 09, 2018 1:52 pm

Better never than late but here it is anyway.

Image
https://arstechnica.com/cars/2018/03/fi ... batteries/

Notable quote
The Semi has ambitious specs that haven't been vetted in the real world yet—Musk promised that the top-line trucks would have a 500-mile range and an 80,000lb maximum load.
Of which only 40,000lb is usable after subtracting the 40,000lb weight of the battery pack. And let's not point out the energy costs of hauling that 40,000lb' battery pack around.

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Re: Electric truck

Post by sparks » Fri Mar 09, 2018 2:03 pm

Charged battery energy density is nowhere near diesel energy density. The recharge energy has to come from somewhere.

Whole concept is a fucking snipe hunt. Makes no sense at all. Burn some diesel here or some coal over there. Either way, you're fucked.
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Re: Electric truck

Post by Rob Lister » Fri Mar 09, 2018 2:20 pm

sparks wrote:Charged battery energy density is nowhere near diesel energy density. The recharge energy has to come from somewhere.

Whole concept is a fucking snipe hunt. Makes no sense at all. Burn some diesel here or some coal over there. Either way, you're fucked.
Not a great argument. The chain of efficiency between the two systems is fairly equal with electric just eking ahead. The energy to that electric solution may be from any number of sources, most of which are much cleaner than diesel or gasoline, with the worst of which--coal--being roughly equal.

Electric cars can be a smart solution.
Electric semis not so much as it has a reverse economy of scale.

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Re: Electric truck

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Fri Mar 09, 2018 2:37 pm

Besides, the trucks are a fire hazard.

Just like that automated train NYC used to have that kept catching fire while no one was looking.
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Re: Electric truck

Post by sparks » Fri Mar 09, 2018 4:21 pm

Rob Lister wrote:
sparks wrote:Charged battery energy density is nowhere near diesel energy density. The recharge energy has to come from somewhere.

Whole concept is a fucking snipe hunt. Makes no sense at all. Burn some diesel here or some coal over there. Either way, you're fucked.
Not a great argument. The chain of efficiency between the two systems is fairly equal with electric just eking ahead. The energy to that electric solution may be from any number of sources, most of which are much cleaner than diesel or gasoline, with the worst of which--coal--being roughly equal.

Electric cars can be a smart solution.
Electric semis not so much as it has a reverse economy of scale.
Evidences on the comparison of efficiency?

Agreed that infernal combustion engines driving wheels through a transmission is horribly inefficient. But one wonders how efficient, as pointed out earlier in the thread, it is to haul around 40,000 pounds of batteries. That is one heavy fucking fuel tank.

Let's ignore the 500 mile range claim for the moment.
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Re: Electric truck

Post by Rob Lister » Fri Mar 09, 2018 5:21 pm

sparks wrote:
Rob Lister wrote:
sparks wrote:Charged battery energy density is nowhere near diesel energy density. The recharge energy has to come from somewhere.

Whole concept is a fucking snipe hunt. Makes no sense at all. Burn some diesel here or some coal over there. Either way, you're fucked.
Not a great argument. The chain of efficiency between the two systems is fairly equal with electric just eking ahead. The energy to that electric solution may be from any number of sources, most of which are much cleaner than diesel or gasoline, with the worst of which--coal--being roughly equal.

Electric cars can be a smart solution.
Electric semis not so much as it has a reverse economy of scale.
Evidences on the comparison of efficiency?

Agreed that infernal combustion engines driving wheels through a transmission is horribly inefficient. But one wonders how efficient, as pointed out earlier in the thread, it is to haul around 40,000 pounds of batteries.
Yea, that was me. And whereas mine was a valid argument against the use of electric for trucks, yours is not a valid argument against the use of electric in general; either that or it's a very nice snipe worth hunting.

You can find general baselines for ERI's here
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/a ... 1513003856

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Re: Electric truck

Post by sparks » Sat Mar 10, 2018 3:22 am

"yours is not a valid argument against the use of electric in general;"

Sorry about the misunderstanding: My argument wasn't meant to be against the use of electric in general.

We are on the same page here.
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