## The Hicks are Hoarding Ammo

Lies, damned lies, and statistics.
WildCat
Posts: 13832
Joined: Tue Jun 15, 2004 2:53 am
Location: The 33rd Ward, Chicago
Has thanked: 32 times
Been thanked: 327 times

### Re: The Hicks are Hoarding Ammo

corplinx wrote:http://www.forbes.com/sites/danielfishe ... the-1970s/

Nice article on the bullet bubba bubble.
ammo buyers are like consumers queuing for gas or loading up on gold in the inflationary 1970s. They’re creating their own shortage.
There was an actual shortage of gas in the 1970s, the direct result of Nixon's price controls. This is ECON 101.

Do you have questions about God?

you sniveling little right-wing nutter - jj

hammegk
Posts: 15134
Joined: Sun Jun 06, 2004 1:16 pm
Title: Curmudgeon
Location: Hither, sometimes Yon
Has thanked: 386 times
Been thanked: 28 times

### Re: The Hicks are Hoarding Ammo

Cool Hand wrote:My takeaway is that "Department of Homeland Security" was always a frighteningly Orwellian name for a federal agency, and if any part of the story in Forbes is true, then it is much more frightening now than it was when it was created.

This is the reason for the existence of the Second Amendment. It's to ensure that the citizenry can preserve the democratic/republican process from a military coup, even a bloodless one. It's a shame the purpose and historical foundation has become so buried in partisan rhetoric and fear mongering during my lifetime. Disarming the populace and shoring up the arms of government (DHS is looking more and more like a para-military force) will be a fatal mistake to our nation as we know it, if that's what occurs.

Fear your government. It doesn't matter who is in power. Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Arming the DHS like a military force is liberty gone horribly wrong.

A republic if you can keep it, indeed.

CH
http://www.mypalmbeachpost.com/news/new ... -un/nXbs4/

I suspect that pisses you off as much as it does me; DHS/Police = Stazi/Staci.

WASPs are the last unprotected group here.

ETA: http://cnsnews.com/blog/gregory-gwyn-wi ... -necessary

Count me in, although I'd be pretty worthless.

Cool Hand
Posts: 9999
Joined: Sun Jun 06, 2004 4:09 pm
Location: Earning my avatar in the rain
Been thanked: 129 times

### Re: The Hicks are Hoarding Ammo

hammegk wrote: http://www.mypalmbeachpost.com/news/new ... -un/nXbs4/

I suspect that pisses you off as much as it does me; DHS/Police = Stazi/Staci.
You bet it does.

[Palm Beach County Sheriff Ric Bradshaw] plans to use the extra $1 million to launch “prevention intervention” units featuring specially trained deputies, mental health professionals and caseworkers. The teams will respond to citizen phone calls to a 24-hour hotline with a knock on the door and a referral to services, if needed. The goal will be avoiding crime — and making sure law enforcement knows about potential powder kegs before tragedies occur, Bradshaw said. But the earmark, which is a one-time-only funding provision, provoked a debate Monday among mental health advocates and providers about the balance between civil liberties, privacy and protecting the public. Good intentions... Bradshaw is readying a hotline and is planning public service announcements to encourage local citizens to report their neighbors, friends or family members if they fear they could harm themselves or others. Relying on reports from tattlers. What could possibly go wrong? The goal won’t be to arrest troubled people but to get them help before there’s violence, Bradshaw said. As a side benefit, law enforcement will have needed information to keep a close eye on things. In other words, we're going to build a file on possible troublemakers. No way will that ever be abused. Keeping files on law abiding citizens? Sounds fine by me. How about you, Heinrich? “We want people to call us if the guy down the street says he hates the government, hates the mayor and he’s gonna shoot him,” Bradshaw said. “What does it hurt to have somebody knock on a door and ask, ‘Hey, is everything OK?’ ” Let me see your papers. How do you feel about our government? The President? The Governor? Your council person? Hey, does this guy look Jewish to you? Mental health advocates, however, worry about a potential new source of stigma, and the potential for erosion of the civil rights of people with mental illnesses. “How are they possibly going to watch everybody who makes a comment like that? It’s subjective,” said Liz Downey, executive director of the Palm Beach County branch of the National Alliance on Mental Illness. “We don’t want to take away people’s civil liberties just because people aren’t behaving the way we think they should be.” Good point. Bradshaw acknowledged the risk that anyone in a messy divorce or in a dispute with a neighbor could abuse the hotline. But, he said, he’s confident that his trained professionals will know how to sort out fact from fiction. “We know how to sift through frivolous complaints,” he said. Trust us. Yeah, OK, Hermann. CH ....life purpose is pay taxes -- pillory 12/05/13 And you run and you run to catch up with the sun but it's sinking Racing around to come up behind you again The sun is the same in a relative way, but you're older Shorter of breath and one day closer to death. "Time" -- Pink Floyd Anaxagoras Posts: 21450 Joined: Wed Mar 19, 2008 5:45 am Location: Yokohama/Tokyo, Japan Has thanked: 1386 times Been thanked: 1173 times ### Re: The Hicks are Hoarding Ammo WildCat wrote:There was an actual shortage of gas in the 1970s, the direct result of Nixon's price controls. This is ECON 101. Bad example. An OPEC embargo was the primary cause. Price controls probably exacerbated the problem. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_oil_crisis The 1973 oil crisis started in October 1973, when the members of Organization of Arab Petroleum Exporting Countries or the OAPEC (consisting of the Arab members of OPEC, plus Egypt, Syria and Tunisia) proclaimed an oil embargo. Earlier that year, Egypt and Syria, with the support of other Arab nations, launched a surprise attack on Israel on the holiest day of the Jewish calendar, Yom Kippur. As Israel was vastly outnumbered, it went on full nuclear alert, loading warheads into planes and long-range missiles.[1] Based on this, the United States chose to re-supply Israel with arms and in response, OAPEC decided to "punish" the United States.[2] It lasted until March 1974.[3] With the Arab nations' actions seen as initiating the oil embargo and the long-term possibility of high oil prices, disrupted supply, and recession, a strong rift was created within NATO. Additionally, some European nations and Japan sought to disassociate themselves from the U.S. policy in the Middle East. Arab oil producers had also linked the end of the embargo with successful U.S. efforts to create peace in the Middle East, which complicated the situation. To address these developments, the Nixon Administration began parallel negotiations with both Arab oil producers to end the embargo, and with Egypt, Syria, and Israel to arrange an Israeli pull back from the Sinai and the Golan Heights after the Arabs withdrew from Israeli territory. By January 18, 1974, Secretary of State Henry Kissinger had negotiated an Israeli troop withdrawal from parts of the Sinai. The promise of a negotiated settlement between Israel and Syria was sufficient to convince Arab oil producers to lift the embargo in March 1974.[3] Price controls and rationing Government price controls further exacerbated the crisis in the United States,[31] which limited the price of "old oil" (that already discovered) while allowing newly discovered oil to be sold at a higher price, resulting in a withdrawal of old oil from the market and the creation of artificial scarcity. The rule also discouraged alternative energies or more efficient fuels or technologies from being developed.[31] The rule had been intended to promote oil exploration.[34] This scarcity was dealt with by rationing of gasoline (which occurred in many countries), with motorists facing long lines at gas stations beginning in summer 1972 and increasing by summer 1973.[31] In 1973, U.S. President Richard Nixon named William E. Simon as the first Administrator of the Federal Energy Office, or the "Energy Czar".[35] Simon allocated states the same amount of domestic oil for 1974 that each consumed in 1972, which worked well for states whose populations were not increasing.[36] In states with increased populations, lines at gasoline stations were common.[36] The American Automobile Association reported that in the last week of February 1974, 20% of American gasoline stations had no fuel at all.[36] A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool. William Shakespeare WildCat Posts: 13832 Joined: Tue Jun 15, 2004 2:53 am Location: The 33rd Ward, Chicago Has thanked: 32 times Been thanked: 327 times ### Re: The Hicks are Hoarding Ammo Holy fuck did I score tonight! On a whim I drove way out to the Cabela's in Hoffman Estates, and by pure luck they had just got a shipment of ammo! I got an almost-mythical these days 525-round box of Remington .22 LR hollow points for$24!

I was stunned, I kept looking at the box to make sure they weren't shot loads or shorts or subsonic. Now I can take my nephew shooting on Memorial Day weekend.
Do you have questions about God?

you sniveling little right-wing nutter - jj

corplinx
Posts: 20005
Joined: Tue Jan 29, 2008 12:49 am
Title: Moderator
Has thanked: 210 times
Been thanked: 656 times

WildCat wrote:Holy fuck did I score tonight! On a whim I drove way out to the Cabela's in Hoffman Estates, and by pure luck they had just got a shipment of ammo! I got an almost-mythical these days 525-round box of Remington .22 LR hollow points for $24! I was stunned, I kept looking at the box to make sure they weren't shot loads or shorts or subsonic. Now I can take my nephew shooting on Memorial Day weekend. Plinking with a .22 is too much fun. WildCat Posts: 13832 Joined: Tue Jun 15, 2004 2:53 am Location: The 33rd Ward, Chicago Has thanked: 32 times Been thanked: 327 times ### Re: The Hicks are Hoarding Ammo I think we're just about over the crisis. Last few times I was at the store they had ammo in stock except for 9mm and .22 rimfire, but everything else was there on the once-bare shelves. Even previously impossible to find reloading supplies like primer, powder, and bullets were in stock. Got the day off tomorrow, so in the morning I'm going to burn through a few hundred rounds of my .40s&w stockpile at the range. It's "1/2 price Friday" so just$10 for unlimited range time, then I'm heading to my friend's boat to get good and drunk as the sun goes down over the skyline.

Life is good!
Do you have questions about God?

you sniveling little right-wing nutter - jj

ed
Posts: 33013
Joined: Tue Jun 08, 2004 11:52 pm
Title: Rhino of the Florida swamp
Has thanked: 438 times
Been thanked: 751 times

### Re: The Hicks are Hoarding Ammo

WildCat wrote:I think we're just about over the crisis. Last few times I was at the store they had ammo in stock except for 9mm and .22 rimfire, but everything else was there on the once-bare shelves. Even previously impossible to find reloading supplies like primer, powder, and bullets were in stock.

Got the day off tomorrow, so in the morning I'm going to burn through a few hundred rounds of my .40s&w stockpile at the range. It's "1/2 price Friday" so just $10 for unlimited range time, then I'm heading to my friend's boat to get good and drunk as the sun goes down over the skyline. Life is good! Out of curiosity, why .40s&w? Wenn ich Kultur höre, entsichere ich meinen Browning! WildCat Posts: 13832 Joined: Tue Jun 15, 2004 2:53 am Location: The 33rd Ward, Chicago Has thanked: 32 times Been thanked: 327 times ### Re: The Hicks are Hoarding Ammo ed wrote: WildCat wrote:I think we're just about over the crisis. Last few times I was at the store they had ammo in stock except for 9mm and .22 rimfire, but everything else was there on the once-bare shelves. Even previously impossible to find reloading supplies like primer, powder, and bullets were in stock. Got the day off tomorrow, so in the morning I'm going to burn through a few hundred rounds of my .40s&w stockpile at the range. It's "1/2 price Friday" so just$10 for unlimited range time, then I'm heading to my friend's boat to get good and drunk as the sun goes down over the skyline.

Life is good!

Out of curiosity, why .40s&w?
Mainly because when I bought it Chicago had a 12 round magazine limit (since gone bye-bye thanks to state pre-emption with the new concealed carry law) which pretty much ruled out 9mm unless I wanted a tiny little single stack, which is fine for concealed carry but those things aren't much fun at the range. Too damn hard to hit anything beyond 10 yards with that short right radius. My .40 is a Beretta PX4 Compact (12 round mag), fits my hand perfectly, is concealable, and packs much more of a wallop than 9mm anyway if it ever comes to that.

I've put about 700 rounds through it so far without a single misfire or malfunction, and have learned to handle the recoil such that I can obliterate the bullseye of my targets now. Had to unlearn a lot of bad habits from my only other pistol, a Ruger MkII .22. That's a great shooter and a tack driver, but no recoil at all so it's easy to pick up bad habits.

The plus side is throughout this crisis .40s&w was much more available than 9mm ammo.

It's only slightly more expensive than 9mm, and now that I'm reloading my brass the cost per round is 25 cents or so. Which brings up a downside of Glocks, they don't have a fully supported chamber which can crate weak spots in the brass which can be dangerous to reload. The PX4 has a fully supported chamber that locks down tight, one of the strongest actions there is.
Do you have questions about God?

you sniveling little right-wing nutter - jj

corplinx
Posts: 20005
Joined: Tue Jan 29, 2008 12:49 am
Title: Moderator
Has thanked: 210 times
Been thanked: 656 times

### Re: The Hicks are Hoarding Ammo

It will be interesting to see what happens to all this stockpiled ammo now.

Doctor X
Posts: 67488
Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2004 8:09 pm
Title: Collective Messiah
Has thanked: 3374 times
Been thanked: 2144 times

### Re: The Hicks are Hoarding Ammo

Mob of the Mean: Free beanie, cattle-prod and Charley Fan Club!
"Doctor X is just treating you the way he treats everyone--as subhuman crap too dumb to breathe in after you breathe out."--Don
DocX: FTW.--sparks
"Doctor X wins again."--Pyrrho
"Never sorry to make a racist Fucktard cry."--His Humble MagNIfIcence
"It was the criticisms of Doc X, actually, that let me see more clearly how far the hypocrisy had gone."--clarsct
"I'd leave it up to Doctor X who has been a benevolent tyrant so far."--Grammatron
"Indeed you are a river to your people.
Shit. That's going to end up in your sig."--Pyrrho
"Try a twelve step program and accept Doctor X as your High Power."--asthmatic camel
"just like Doc X said." --gnome

WS CHAMPIONS X3!!! NBA CHAMPIONS!! Stanley Cup! SB CHAMPIONS X5!!!!!
AL East Champs!!

ed
Posts: 33013
Joined: Tue Jun 08, 2004 11:52 pm
Title: Rhino of the Florida swamp
Has thanked: 438 times
Been thanked: 751 times

### Re: The Hicks are Hoarding Ammo

corplinx wrote:It will be interesting to see what happens to all this stockpiled ammo now.
Indeed. I've seen a little softening of prices.

I think that people simply won't buy as much. BTW that $29 box of .22'a that wildcat bought a couple of years ago is now ~$45
Wenn ich Kultur höre, entsichere ich meinen Browning!

Abdul Alhazred
Posts: 70748
Joined: Mon Jun 07, 2004 1:33 pm
Title: Yes, that one.
Location: Chicago
Has thanked: 3162 times
Been thanked: 1169 times

### Re: The Hicks are Hoarding Ammo

corplinx wrote:It will be interesting to see what happens to all this stockpiled ammo now.
Some might think it's a good idea to stockpile ammo no matter who is president.

After all it's not the president you'd be fighting, not directly anyway.

It''s the folks who want to steal your stockpile of field rations. Or the folks whose stockpile of field rations ...
Any man writes a mission statement spends a night in the box.
-- our mission statement plappendale

corplinx
Posts: 20005
Joined: Tue Jan 29, 2008 12:49 am
Title: Moderator
Has thanked: 210 times
Been thanked: 656 times

### Re: The Hicks are Hoarding Ammo

"I gotta buy muh ammo in case all these pink hat wearing women commies revolt"

Witness
Posts: 16428
Joined: Thu Sep 19, 2013 5:50 pm
Has thanked: 1988 times
Been thanked: 2718 times

### Re: The Hicks are Hoarding Ammo

Reading the thread I wondered if somebody ever tried, or at least suggested, solving the "gun problem" by taxing it to death? (Like it's done for tobacco right now.)

WildCat
Posts: 13832
Joined: Tue Jun 15, 2004 2:53 am
Location: The 33rd Ward, Chicago
Has thanked: 32 times
Been thanked: 327 times

### Re: The Hicks are Hoarding Ammo

Witness wrote:Reading the thread I wondered if somebody ever tried, or at least suggested, solving the "gun problem" by taxing it to death? (Like it's done for tobacco right now.)
Do you think you can solve "the abortion problem" by taxing it to death? A \$10,000 tax for abortion, using the proceeds to pay for sex education and birth control?
Do you have questions about God?

you sniveling little right-wing nutter - jj

Doctor X
Posts: 67488
Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2004 8:09 pm
Title: Collective Messiah
Has thanked: 3374 times
Been thanked: 2144 times

### Re: The Hicks are Hoarding Ammo

--J.D.
Mob of the Mean: Free beanie, cattle-prod and Charley Fan Club!
"Doctor X is just treating you the way he treats everyone--as subhuman crap too dumb to breathe in after you breathe out."--Don
DocX: FTW.--sparks
"Doctor X wins again."--Pyrrho
"Never sorry to make a racist Fucktard cry."--His Humble MagNIfIcence
"It was the criticisms of Doc X, actually, that let me see more clearly how far the hypocrisy had gone."--clarsct
"I'd leave it up to Doctor X who has been a benevolent tyrant so far."--Grammatron
"Indeed you are a river to your people.
Shit. That's going to end up in your sig."--Pyrrho
"Try a twelve step program and accept Doctor X as your High Power."--asthmatic camel
"just like Doc X said." --gnome

WS CHAMPIONS X3!!! NBA CHAMPIONS!! Stanley Cup! SB CHAMPIONS X5!!!!!
AL East Champs!!

Anaxagoras
Posts: 21450
Joined: Wed Mar 19, 2008 5:45 am
Location: Yokohama/Tokyo, Japan
Has thanked: 1386 times
Been thanked: 1173 times

### Re: The Hicks are Hoarding Ammo

Witness wrote:Reading the thread I wondered if somebody ever tried, or at least suggested, solving the "gun problem" by taxing it to death? (Like it's done for tobacco right now.)
I'm sure it's been "suggested" many times, but this is 'Murica!!!

Gun owners wouldn't take that sitting down is what I'm saying.

Like Wildcat says, I'm sure that lots of people would like to put a big fat tax on the things they don't like, but the people who like those things vote too.
A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool.
William Shakespeare

ed
Posts: 33013
Joined: Tue Jun 08, 2004 11:52 pm
Title: Rhino of the Florida swamp
Has thanked: 438 times
Been thanked: 751 times

### Re: The Hicks are Hoarding Ammo

Witness wrote:Reading the thread I wondered if somebody ever tried, or at least suggested, solving the "gun problem" by taxing it to death? (Like it's done for tobacco right now.)
Without getting into nuances, gun ownership is a constitutionally protected right. Back door diminution of it would probably not pass judicial review.

Sort of like poll taxes. a No-no.

Why do you hate freedom?
Wenn ich Kultur höre, entsichere ich meinen Browning!

Abdul Alhazred
Posts: 70748
Joined: Mon Jun 07, 2004 1:33 pm
Title: Yes, that one.
Location: Chicago
Has thanked: 3162 times
Been thanked: 1169 times

### Re: The Hicks are Hoarding Ammo

Getting rid of poll taxes required an explicit new amendment within living memory.

Otherwise, the point is correct.
Any man writes a mission statement spends a night in the box.
-- our mission statement plappendale