Impeach Trump, already!

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Re: Impeach Trump, already!

Post by Grammatron » Mon Oct 16, 2017 5:58 pm

gnome wrote:I would say that if the sins of Trump's opposition are minimized or dismissed, that it is part of the same phenomenon at work--short-term partisanship over accountability. Trump is just (in my perception) an outlier, successfully using that strategy against revelations that would have ended most political careers.

Never mind that keeping your own house clean forms a stronger party in the long run.
Ok but what did Trump actually do that warrants an impeachment?

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Re: Impeach Trump, already!

Post by gnome » Mon Oct 16, 2017 8:01 pm

Oh! Nothing yet, unless evidence emerges of something worse than anything already confirmed.
"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight! Sun Tzu said that, and I'd say he knows a little bit more about fighting than you do, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living man could best him in the ring of honor. Then, he used his fight money to buy two of every animal on earth, and then he herded them onto a boat, and then he beat the crap out of every single one. And from that day forward any time a bunch of animals are together in one place it's called a zoo! (Beat) Unless it's a farm!"
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Re: Impeach Trump, already!

Post by Grammatron » Mon Oct 16, 2017 8:06 pm

gnome wrote:Oh! Nothing yet...
Ok. But then why do you have this position:
At this point Trump's default position on anything would be "so what?" and enough supporters would go along with it rather than let those evil Democrats win.

What keeps me up at night is that this is a strategy that doesn't lock in to any particular ideology. Anyone can do it if beating the opposition is sufficiently prioritized over all else.

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Re: Impeach Trump, already!

Post by gnome » Mon Oct 16, 2017 11:21 pm

I was referring to the hypothetical effect of anything Larry Flynt might be able to dig up on him.
Not anything that has already been revealed.
"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight! Sun Tzu said that, and I'd say he knows a little bit more about fighting than you do, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living man could best him in the ring of honor. Then, he used his fight money to buy two of every animal on earth, and then he herded them onto a boat, and then he beat the crap out of every single one. And from that day forward any time a bunch of animals are together in one place it's called a zoo! (Beat) Unless it's a farm!"
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Re: Impeach Trump, already!

Post by Grammatron » Mon Oct 16, 2017 11:28 pm

gnome wrote:I was referring to the hypothetical effect of anything Larry Flynt might be able to dig up on him.
Not anything that has already been revealed.
That's kind of the point though: Everything's that's been revealed is either not an impeachable offense or is bullshit; Trump's supporter keep dismissing the allegations because everything's that's been revealed is either not an impeachable offense or is bullshit.

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Re: Impeach Trump, already!

Post by Anaxagoras » Mon Oct 16, 2017 11:41 pm

Abdul Alhazred wrote: I didn't realize Flynt was still alive.

Anyone want him for the dead pool? :)
He finally beat Hefner at something. ;)
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Re: Impeach Trump, already!

Post by gnome » Mon Oct 16, 2017 11:43 pm

Grammatron wrote:
gnome wrote:I was referring to the hypothetical effect of anything Larry Flynt might be able to dig up on him.
Not anything that has already been revealed.
That's kind of the point though: Everything's that's been revealed is either not an impeachable offense or is bullshit; Trump's supporter keep dismissing the allegations because everything's that's been revealed is either not an impeachable offense or is bullshit.
True enough, I am speculating on the behavior of supporters to something that hasn't happened yet. What I have to go on for that speculation is that dynamic certainly occurred for items that would have sunk a presidential campaign for most others.
"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight! Sun Tzu said that, and I'd say he knows a little bit more about fighting than you do, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living man could best him in the ring of honor. Then, he used his fight money to buy two of every animal on earth, and then he herded them onto a boat, and then he beat the crap out of every single one. And from that day forward any time a bunch of animals are together in one place it's called a zoo! (Beat) Unless it's a farm!"
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Re: Impeach Trump, already!

Post by Doctor X » Tue Oct 17, 2017 5:56 am

I will remind that Impeachment requires a majority in the House of Representatives. Conviction requires a 2/3rds majority in the Senate.

Loons aside, Congress and the Senate takes these things seriously. Impeachment and removal were never intended to be a way to turn the government into a parliamentary system.

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Re: Impeach Trump, already!

Post by Anaxagoras » Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:23 am

Drumpf is done for sure now:

How Anti-Trump Psychiatrists Are Mobilizing Behind the Twenty-Fifth Amendment
The removal of Trump using the Twenty-fifth Amendment is the aim of a newly launched social movement composed of mental-health professionals. The group, called Duty to Warn, claims that Donald Trump “suffers from an incurable malignant narcissism that makes him incapable of carrying out his presidential duties and poses a danger to the nation.” On Saturday, the organization held coördinated kickoff events in fourteen cities, where mental-health experts spoke out about Trump’s dangerousness and, in several, took to the streets in organized funereal marches, complete with drum corps.

Dr. John Gartner, the founder of Duty to Warn, told me that the event drew nearly a thousand participants across the country. At the Washington, D.C., event, the group presented an award to Representative Jamie Raskin, a Democrat from Maryland and the sponsor of a bill that the group endorses. H.R. 1987 proposes an “Oversight Commission on Presidential Capacity” that, under the Twenty-fifth Amendment, would serve as the congressionally appointed body for determining whether the President cannot execute the powers and duties of his office owing to mental illness or deficiency.
(side note: for some reason the New Yorker seems to use umlauts in words like "coördinated". I'm not sure why, because I don't think that's standard practice in English. Oh, here's an explanation. :roll: )
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Re: Impeach Trump, already!

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:28 am

I seem to recall this is professionally unethical (the Goldwater rule).

In effect they are admitting they are quacks. This story could just as easily go in the "See what Trump made me do" thread.

(side note: for some reason the New Yorker seems to use umlauts in words like "coördinated". I'm not sure why, because I don't think that's standard practice in English. Oh, here's an explanation. :roll: )

Pfft! It's because it's the sort of hoity toity thing Eustace Tilley woiud do,
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Re: Impeach Trump, already!

Post by Doctor X » Tue Oct 17, 2017 5:20 pm

Anaxagoras wrote:(side note: for some reason the New Yorker seems to use umlauts in words like "coördinated". I'm not sure why, because I don't think that's standard practice in English. Oh, here's an explanation. :roll: )
Funny, I was going to comment that that is one of the reasons I like the New Yorker despite it being a Surrender-Monkey Supporter of Rapists, Criminals, and Traitors [New York Yankees and Jets.--Ed.]. The problem is that most English speakers do not suffer from diaeresis: people do not say "coor-dinate" nor "ree-lect." Perhaps, the Furiners do:
Along with Psycho-Pass, I saw two other anime where either 'Murican character or the Japanese characters try to speak English. By and large, the seiyū [Stop that.--Ed.] do not handle it well. They tend to pronounce English vowels like Japanese vowels. You might have noticed the character "Spookie Boogie" where they figured out "oo" has an "ū" sound but they hold it for far too long like a Japanese lengthened vowel: "Spooooookie Boooooooogie."

Not a critic, I can at least understand their "Engrish;" whereas my Japanese--"Eihongo!"--tends to be met with stares, tossed objects, and the question, "can't you speak English?" :oops:
But then I love that The Economist uses "moot" correctly.

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Re: Impeach Trump, already!

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Sun Nov 12, 2017 6:31 pm

The Republican response, or at any rate that of the "House freedom caucus".

They are going to impeach Hillary. :)

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Re: Impeach Trump, already!

Post by Pyrrho » Sun Nov 12, 2017 6:45 pm

https://www.wired.com/story/trumps-taxe ... en-hacked/
Whether his motivation was good or bad, Hamlett's hacking skills apparently weren’t great. Court records suggest he disregarded basic lessons of Hacking 101: First, don’t use your personal cell phone when penetration-testing the federal government; and second, don’t immediately confess when FBI and IRS agents engage you in a conversation in the lobby of an Embassy Suites hotel in Baton Rouge. Despite his rookie mistakes, Hamlett reportedly came close to getting the president’s personal tax information. And that says a lot.

Considering Trump’s risk profile, the determination of his detractors, and the current state of cybersecurity, it’s almost inconceivable his tax returns haven’t been hacked—successfully—by someone with more experience and expertise.

After all, American taxpayers should assume their personally identifying information is already in the hands of criminals and then act accordingly, as former IRS commissioner John Koskinen recently told reporters.
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Re: Impeach Trump, already!

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Wed Nov 15, 2017 5:11 pm

Update: Step by step, inch by inch ...

With specific charges, even. :)

House Dems introduce articles of impeachment against Trump (MSN)
...

Among those, the lawmakers say Trump obstructed justice when he fired former FBI Director James Comey, who was leading the federal investigation into Moscow's 2016 election meddling -- a probe that has included questions of potential collusion between Russia and the Trump campaign team.

They're also accusing Trump of violating the foreign emoluments clause -- which bars public officials from receiving gifts from foreign governments without Congress's consent-- and the domestic emoluments clause, which bars the president from profiting from his office.

Finally, the Democrats say the president has undermined two of the country's central institutions -- the courts and the press -- in ways that threaten the health of the nation's democracy.

The impeachment clause, Green said, "was drafted for a time such as this and a president such as this."

...
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Re: Impeach Trump, already!

Post by Rob Lister » Wed Nov 15, 2017 7:56 pm

I'm going to go ahead and vote to impeach without even reading the bill. Pence will make a reasonable president.

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Re: Impeach Trump, already!

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Tue Nov 28, 2017 5:20 am

Trump is Finished AGAIN :)

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Re: Impeach Trump, already!

Post by Anaxagoras » Tue Nov 28, 2017 6:59 am

Drumpf is done??

In that vein, I'll just leave this here:

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/27/opin ... ussia.html

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Re: Impeach Trump, already!

Post by Anaxagoras » Tue Nov 28, 2017 7:08 am

Meanwhile, the case against Flynn seems to be getting more serious:

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nati ... story.html
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Re: Impeach Trump, already!

Post by Doctor X » Tue Nov 28, 2017 10:02 am

Serious, but oddly enough, not related to Trump.

What a sad irony in that the Independent Counsel [Cue Thunderclap--Ed.], tasked to investigate TRUMP-RUSKIE COLLUSIONSSs!--which would not actually be illegal, but that is another discussion--instead exposes the "dirty laundry" of hangers on who lined up to feed upon the Federal Trough. In other words, had they not wanted the jobs they may have never been investigated.

Here is the odd thing about Mueller: his "successes" are read as failures. He was tasked with investigating how Goodell and his cronies FAIL'd to recognize that Ray Lewis punched the light-out of his girlfriend. He claimed he never saw the video . . . that was sent to him. Ironically, he did not turn over his own phone, something he retrofitted to go after the Greatest of All Time. I mean, when you consider that with under 5 minutes they were still down two sc[GET ON WITH IT!!--Ed.]

Right . . . er . . . yeah . . . anyways, though "everyone knows" Goodell ignored the problem until the video became public and he could no longer ignore the issue--and trumped up "deflategate" to distract from the Ravens--owner is a friend--pressuring the victim blah . . . blah . . . Mueller could not prove it as a matter of law. So he "failed," but he "did his job."

Similarly, Stark "failed" to prove Whitewater--due to one key witness dying and his wife willing to spend a year in jail rather than testify against the Clinton Syndicate [Sigh.--Ed.]--but his investigation revealed Clinton lying under oath.

So if Mueller finds no evidences--thanks--of Trump violating the law, he will have done his "job," but +50% of America and most of Los Angeles will conclude he FAIL since "we all know" Trump "musta" violated the law. See the fatuous claims of I Am a Random Congressman Who Needs to Run Next Year who put forth these "Articles of Impeachment."

Anti-Trumpsters will claim "the fix was in"--just as America's Team the Greatest Dynasty in NFL History Haters try to claim the last SB was "fixed!" by the same Goodell! His job is not to indict Trump, but to investigate to determine if laws have been broken. However, by the nature of the adversarial system, a prosecutor who cannot find a reason to prosecute is seen as a "failure."

However, if he DOES find crimes, Trump supporters will treat him like Clinton rump-swabbers treated Stark: they will diminish the crimes and blame the prosecutor.

Sorry to . . .

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DocX: FTW.--sparks
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"It was the criticisms of Doc X, actually, that let me see more clearly how far the hypocrisy had gone."--clarsct
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Re: Impeach Trump, already!

Post by Anaxagoras » Tue Nov 28, 2017 11:39 am

I never watched any of Olberman's commentaries for GQ before, but curiosity got the better of me. Well he said this would be his final one so I just wanted to see what his reasons were.

He looks like a man who is at the end of his rope. Toward the end of it I actually wondered if he was about to start weeping. I think he's quitting because he just can't keep it up anymore. He needs to go to a quiet place and turn off the TV and the Internet and just meditate or something.
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