Venezuela Meltdown

Lies, damned lies, and statistics.
User avatar
Skeeve
Posts: 9563
Joined: Wed Jun 09, 2004 7:35 am
Has thanked: 26 times
Been thanked: 68 times

Re: Venezuela Meltdown

Postby Skeeve » Wed Feb 07, 2018 2:03 pm

This one is rather depressing....
Venezuela has the largest proven oil reserves in the world. But in the last three years its economy has collapsed.

SAN CASIMIRO, Venezuela — Kenyerber Aquino Merchán was 17 months old when he starved to death.

His father left before dawn to bring him home from the hospital morgue. He carried Kenyerber’s skeletal frame into the kitchen and handed it to a mortuary worker who makes house calls for Venezuelan families with no money for funerals.

Kenyerber’s spine and rib cage protruded as the embalming chemicals were injected. Aunts shooed away curious young cousins, mourners arrived with wildflowers from the hills, and relatives cut out a pair of cardboard wings from one of the empty white ration boxes that families increasingly depend on amid the food shortages and soaring food prices throttling the nation. They gently placed the tiny wings on top of Kenyerber’s coffin to help his soul reach heaven — a tradition when a baby dies in Venezuela.
...
But deaths from malnutrition have remained a closely guarded secret by the Venezuelan government. In a five-month investigation by The New York Times, doctors at 21 public hospitals in 17 states across the country said that their emergency rooms were being overwhelmed by children with severe malnutrition — a condition they had rarely encountered before the economic crisis began.
...
The burden of caring for children in Venezuela can be so great these days that many women are opting to be sterilized. Just after dawn one Saturday in July, 21 young women dressed in surgical gowns waited to be surgically sterilized during a free event at the state-run José Gregorio Hernández Hospital in a working-class neighborhood of the capital.
...
The suffering of Venezuelan families is expected to worsen next year. Beyond the I.M.F.’s warning that inflation could surpass 2,300 percent, observers worry that the leftist government will continue to refuse international aid for political reasons.

“If they accept the help, they accept that there is a humanitarian crisis here, and officially recognize that their population is vulnerable, and just how much their policies failed them,” said Susana Raffalli, a specialist on food emergencies who consults for Caritas in Venezuela.

The Venezuelan government has used food to keep the Socialists in power, critics say. Before recent elections, people living in government housing projects said they were visited by representatives of their local Socialist community councils — the government-aligned groups that organize the delivery of boxes of cheap food — and threatened with being cut off if they did not vote for the government.
Then Skank Of America could start in...

User avatar
Abdul Alhazred
Posts: 67970
Joined: Mon Jun 07, 2004 1:33 pm
Title: Yes, that one.
Location: Chicago
Has thanked: 2399 times
Been thanked: 971 times

Re: Venezuela Meltdown

Postby Abdul Alhazred » Wed Feb 07, 2018 2:07 pm

Nothing like a command economy to fuck things up.
Image "If I turn in a sicko, will I get a reward?"

"Yes! A BIG REWARD!" ====> Click here to turn in a sicko
Any man writes a mission statement spends a night in the box.
-- our mission statement plappendale

User avatar
Skeeve
Posts: 9563
Joined: Wed Jun 09, 2004 7:35 am
Has thanked: 26 times
Been thanked: 68 times

Re: Venezuela Meltdown

Postby Skeeve » Sun Feb 11, 2018 8:00 pm

Abdul Alhazred wrote:Nothing like a command economy to fuck things up.


From the Socialist Paradise of....well you know where...

Mad Max violence stalks Venezuela's lawless roads
...
Though events on Venezuela’s roads may seem like something out of the Mad Max movie, truckers say they are often more akin to Robin Hood as assailants are careful not to harm the drivers or their vehicles provided they do not resist.

“The best protection is to be submissive, hand things over,” said Roberto Maldonado, who handles paperwork for truckers in La Grita. “When people are hungry, they are dangerous.”

However, all the truckers interviewed by Reuters said they knew of someone murdered on the roads - mainly during targeted robberies rather than spontaneous lootings.


Venezuelans rush to the border as Colombia tightens controls

Image
Thousands of Venezuelans have rushed to border crossings with Colombia after Colombian President Juan Manuel Santos announced a tightening of controls.


They're both pretty depressing...
Then Skank Of America could start in...

User avatar
WildCat
Posts: 13031
Joined: Tue Jun 15, 2004 2:53 am
Location: The 33rd Ward, Chicago
Has thanked: 25 times
Been thanked: 246 times

Re: Venezuela Meltdown

Postby WildCat » Sun Feb 11, 2018 8:29 pm

Skeeve wrote:They're both pretty depressing...

They're just feeling the Bern!
Do you have questions about God?

you sniveling little right-wing nutter - jj

shuize
Posts: 91
Joined: Tue Nov 14, 2017 4:32 am
Has thanked: 3 times
Been thanked: 22 times

Re: Venezuela Meltdown

Postby shuize » Sun Feb 11, 2018 11:06 pm

Doctor X wrote:I recall a number of very liberal friends who loved Chavez because he "stood up to Bush!"

I am still laughing.

--J.D.

Yes, I also knew some very liberal people who loved Chavez. Unfortunately (or maybe fortunately), they moved away, since I'm sure I would have made a point of asking "So, how are things working out in Venezuela these days?" every chance I got.

On another note, when I was a young lad in university, one of the most beautiful women I ever met was a foreign exchange student from Venezuela. I lost contact with her, but sometimes I wonder if she ever went back. If she did, I really hope she got out.

shuize
Posts: 91
Joined: Tue Nov 14, 2017 4:32 am
Has thanked: 3 times
Been thanked: 22 times

Re: Venezuela Meltdown

Postby shuize » Sun Feb 11, 2018 11:27 pm

Witness wrote:
The Week wrote:How one guy at an Alabama Home Depot controls Venezuela's currency

His name is Gustavo Díaz, and his website, DolarToday, has become a handy financial tool for Venezuelans trying to navigate the underground economy — so handy, in fact, that it affects the price of just about everything in Venezuela.

...

So let's say you have a bunch of bolivars to spend. The official government exchange rate is fixed at 10 bolivars to the dollar. But according to DolarToday, the real street value of the bolivar in Caracas is much lower. It's now well over 4,000 bolivars to the dollar.

https://theweek.com/articles/667073/how-guy-alabama-home-depot-controls-venezuelas-currency

When that article was published in Dec. 2016, the exchange rate was around 4,000 to the dollar.

Today the site says it's 236,854.

shuize
Posts: 91
Joined: Tue Nov 14, 2017 4:32 am
Has thanked: 3 times
Been thanked: 22 times

Re: Venezuela Meltdown

Postby shuize » Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:08 pm

As to how things are working out in Venezuela these days:

OPEC Production Steady In January As Venezuela Output Plunges

According to OPEC’s Monthly Oil Market Report published on Monday, secondary sources—the ones the cartel uses to monitor compliance and official stats—pegged Venezuela’s crude oil production in January 2018 at 1.600 million bpd, down by 47,300 bpd compared to December 2017. This was the largest monthly decline in oil production among OPEC’s 14 member states. Venezuela, allowed to pump as much as 1.972 million bpd under the deal, surely did not make that cut voluntarily—its economy is collapsing and oil production has been in freefall for months now.

https://oilprice.com/Energy/Crude-Oil/O ... unges.html

User avatar
Skeeve
Posts: 9563
Joined: Wed Jun 09, 2004 7:35 am
Has thanked: 26 times
Been thanked: 68 times

Re: Venezuela Meltdown

Postby Skeeve » Wed Feb 14, 2018 1:08 pm

shuize wrote:
Witness wrote:
The Week wrote:How one guy at an Alabama Home Depot controls Venezuela's currency

His name is Gustavo Díaz, and his website, DolarToday, has become a handy financial tool for Venezuelans trying to navigate the underground economy — so handy, in fact, that it affects the price of just about everything in Venezuela.

...

So let's say you have a bunch of bolivars to spend. The official government exchange rate is fixed at 10 bolivars to the dollar. But according to DolarToday, the real street value of the bolivar in Caracas is much lower. It's now well over 4,000 bolivars to the dollar.

https://theweek.com/articles/667073/how-guy-alabama-home-depot-controls-venezuelas-currency

When that article was published in Dec. 2016, the exchange rate was around 4,000 to the dollar.

Today the site says it's 236,854.

So maybe that 'vacation in (not) paradise' article (page 4) wasn't so far off after all....
ImageThe above was what €100 would buy (black market) in bolivares.
Then Skank Of America could start in...

User avatar
Skeeve
Posts: 9563
Joined: Wed Jun 09, 2004 7:35 am
Has thanked: 26 times
Been thanked: 68 times

Re: Venezuela Meltdown

Postby Skeeve » Sun Feb 18, 2018 7:01 pm

More news from The Socialist Paradise Venezuela
Venezuelan firm offers eggs as 'motivational' bonus

A security company in Venezuela has said that it is offering a "motivational" bonus, hoping to recruit more staff members to its team.

A monthly salary of $10 will be accompanied by a bonus, which will include 144 eggs.
...
The currency has collapsed and the minimum wage at the black market rate amounts to about $1 a month.
...
Nicolas Maduro, the country's socialist president, blames these issues on an "economic war" which he believed has been waged by the opposition with the help of the United States.

Meanwhile, critics say his government has wrecked the economy through incompetence and corruption.
Then Skank Of America could start in...

User avatar
WildCat
Posts: 13031
Joined: Tue Jun 15, 2004 2:53 am
Location: The 33rd Ward, Chicago
Has thanked: 25 times
Been thanked: 246 times

Re: Venezuela Meltdown

Postby WildCat » Sun Feb 18, 2018 7:31 pm

Should be: Meanwhile, critics say his government has wrecked the economy through incompetence and corruption Socialism."
Do you have questions about God?

you sniveling little right-wing nutter - jj

User avatar
Skeeve
Posts: 9563
Joined: Wed Jun 09, 2004 7:35 am
Has thanked: 26 times
Been thanked: 68 times

Re: Venezuela Meltdown

Postby Skeeve » Tue Feb 20, 2018 1:23 pm

Struggling Venezuela to start selling 'petro' cryptocurrency

Carlos Vargas, Venezuela's cryptocurrency superintendent, revealed recently that the country was preparing to set out its plans to launch the "petro", with the first sale scheduled for today.

"There will surely be a lot of investors from Qatar, Turkey, and parts of the Middle East, though Europeans and Americans will also participate," Mr Vargas said last week.

But the US Treasury Department has warned potential investors that buying the petro may be in violation of sanctions that stop US banks from buying debt from Venezuela.

Venezuela was in trouble long before President Donald Trump imposed sanctions.

Falling oil prices - in a country reliant on its exports of the commodity - and economic mismanagement have led to a shortage of food, medicine, and dollars to pay its bills.
...
The country's cryptocurrency regulator did not provide further details but, according to Reuters, 38.4% of the petros to be issued will be sold at a 60% discount.


Well, luck on that...
Then Skank Of America could start in...

User avatar
Rob Lister
Posts: 19443
Joined: Sun Jul 18, 2004 7:15 pm
Title: Incipient toppler
Location: Hiding under ed's bed
Has thanked: 531 times
Been thanked: 537 times

Re: Venezuela Meltdown

Postby Rob Lister » Tue Feb 20, 2018 2:33 pm

The country's cryptocurrency regulator ...

Rather oxymoronic.
... 38.4% of the petros to be issued will be sold at a 60% discount.

to the decidedly moronic.

User avatar
Abdul Alhazred
Posts: 67970
Joined: Mon Jun 07, 2004 1:33 pm
Title: Yes, that one.
Location: Chicago
Has thanked: 2399 times
Been thanked: 971 times

Re: Venezuela Meltdown

Postby Abdul Alhazred » Tue Feb 20, 2018 2:36 pm

WildCat wrote:Should be: Meanwhile, critics say his government has wrecked the economy through incompetence and corruption Socialism."


Fair enough, but the immediate cause is still incompetence and corruption,

It's not an either / or thing.
Image "If I turn in a sicko, will I get a reward?"

"Yes! A BIG REWARD!" ====> Click here to turn in a sicko
Any man writes a mission statement spends a night in the box.
-- our mission statement plappendale

User avatar
Skeeve
Posts: 9563
Joined: Wed Jun 09, 2004 7:35 am
Has thanked: 26 times
Been thanked: 68 times

Re: Venezuela Meltdown

Postby Skeeve » Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:36 pm

Rob Lister wrote:
The country's cryptocurrency regulator ...

Rather oxymoronic.
... 38.4% of the petros to be issued will be sold at a 60% discount.

to the decidedly moronic.

It gets better....
Venezuela's President Orders State-Owned Companies to Accept the Petro
Venezuela officially has its own cryptocurrency - and its president wants some of the country's state-owned businesses to use it.

According to a recording posted on Twitter by television network VTV, Venezuelan President Nicolas Maduro has ordered several state-owned companies to convert a percentage of their sales and purchases into the petro.

"I gave the order to the company PDVSA, Pequiven and CVG to realize as of today a percentage of their sales and purchases in...the Petro," Maduro said (according to a rough translation) during the petro pre-sale announcement.

PDVSA is a state-owned oil and natural gas company which, in addition to the Venezuelan government, is also the target of U.S. sanctions. Pequiven is a petrochemical company, and Corporacion Venezolana de Guyana (CVG) is a decentralized conglomerate whose subsidiaries include aluminium and gold producers.


But wait, it gets even better...
...
Just one day after the commencement of the controversial petro-presale, Maduro made waves once again, announcing that he plans to unveil a second cryptocurrency next week: the petro gold.

"Next week I'm going to launch the petro gold, backed by gold, which is even more powerful, that will strengthen the petro," Vice quoted Maduro as saying in a Wednesday speech.
Then Skank Of America could start in...

User avatar
Abdul Alhazred
Posts: 67970
Joined: Mon Jun 07, 2004 1:33 pm
Title: Yes, that one.
Location: Chicago
Has thanked: 2399 times
Been thanked: 971 times

Re: Venezuela Meltdown

Postby Abdul Alhazred » Fri Feb 23, 2018 12:07 am

What exactly is "crypto" about this new alleged currency, other than the government saves on printing costs?
Image "If I turn in a sicko, will I get a reward?"

"Yes! A BIG REWARD!" ====> Click here to turn in a sicko
Any man writes a mission statement spends a night in the box.
-- our mission statement plappendale

User avatar
WildCat
Posts: 13031
Joined: Tue Jun 15, 2004 2:53 am
Location: The 33rd Ward, Chicago
Has thanked: 25 times
Been thanked: 246 times

Re: Venezuela Meltdown

Postby WildCat » Fri Feb 23, 2018 12:12 am

The new currency will be as worthless as the old.

Points for creativity though!
Do you have questions about God?

you sniveling little right-wing nutter - jj

User avatar
Anaxagoras
Posts: 20205
Joined: Wed Mar 19, 2008 5:45 am
Location: Yokohama/Tokyo, Japan
Has thanked: 1237 times
Been thanked: 1011 times

Re: Venezuela Meltdown

Postby Anaxagoras » Fri Feb 23, 2018 1:11 am

In what sense is it "backed" by either gold or oil? Will the government actually give you gold or oil upon demand in exchange?


As an aside, this is why no modern currency uses the gold standard anymore. It's meaningless if you can't actually exchange it for gold. If they did, they would have to keep huge stockpiles of gold, and it's just not practical. Plus your economy is effectively hostage to the price of gold.
A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool.
William Shakespeare

User avatar
Abdul Alhazred
Posts: 67970
Joined: Mon Jun 07, 2004 1:33 pm
Title: Yes, that one.
Location: Chicago
Has thanked: 2399 times
Been thanked: 971 times

Re: Venezuela Meltdown

Postby Abdul Alhazred » Fri Feb 23, 2018 1:15 am

Anaxagoras wrote:In what sense is it "backed" by either gold or oil? Will the government actually give you gold or oil upon demand in exchange?


As an aside, this is why no modern currency uses the gold standard anymore. It's meaningless if you can't actually exchange it for gold. If they did, they would have to keep huge stockpiles of gold, and it's just not practical. Plus your economy is effectively hostage to the price of gold.


Although Federal Reserve Notes are not "backed by gold" in the old sense, the Federal Reserve Bank of New York has enough gold in the basement to prevent anyone else in the world from cornering the market.

Though of course not anywhere near enough to pay off the public debt. Such an amount of gold does not exist.

In a general way, having a huge stock of something valuable is good for keeping a legal tender currency stable, even if not exchangeable on demand.
Image "If I turn in a sicko, will I get a reward?"

"Yes! A BIG REWARD!" ====> Click here to turn in a sicko
Any man writes a mission statement spends a night in the box.
-- our mission statement plappendale

User avatar
Rob Lister
Posts: 19443
Joined: Sun Jul 18, 2004 7:15 pm
Title: Incipient toppler
Location: Hiding under ed's bed
Has thanked: 531 times
Been thanked: 537 times

Re: Venezuela Meltdown

Postby Rob Lister » Fri Feb 23, 2018 1:28 am

Abdul Alhazred wrote:What exactly is "crypto" about this new alleged currency, other than the government saves on printing costs?


For this coin, I don't know, but generally "crypto" refers not to the anonymity of it (which may or may not exist) but rather the method by which new coins are created and transactions are validated;.

To elaborate, some other person (let's call them a miner) must solve a cryptologic puzzle based upon the prior transaction in order to validate any new transaction. If successful, the transaction is recorded and said miner gets a tiny cut of said transaction thereby motivating the continued practice.

Since the solution to the puzzle relies upon the last transaction which in turn relies upon the transaction before it, it is not possible to cheat unless you both have and use the sum of the processing power that went into all of the difficult calculations prior. Even a trivial level of difficulty in solving the puzzle will do once the chain of transactions reaches an arbitrarily large number.

That's the principle of Bitcoin specifically and a blockchain in general.

I could have explained it better if I was younger.
Last edited by Rob Lister on Fri Feb 23, 2018 1:44 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
WildCat
Posts: 13031
Joined: Tue Jun 15, 2004 2:53 am
Location: The 33rd Ward, Chicago
Has thanked: 25 times
Been thanked: 246 times

Re: Venezuela Meltdown

Postby WildCat » Fri Feb 23, 2018 1:34 am

Anaxagoras wrote:Will the government actually give you gold or oil upon demand in exchange?

Surely you don't think Maduro is lying to you?
Do you have questions about God?

you sniveling little right-wing nutter - jj


Return to “Politics & Social Issues”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: CCBot [Bot], Skeeve and 1 guest