#MeTo (TITLE IX edition)

Lies, damned lies, and statistics.
RCC: Act II
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Re: #MeTo (TITLE IX edition)

Postby RCC: Act II » Wed Dec 27, 2017 6:20 pm

ed wrote:The plural of anecdote is not evidence yet many of these things rise above mere storytelling.
If it is a fact that one in the Star Chamber cannot have a lawyer that is a severe problem, as is not having early access to all "evidence" as well as ... well, you get the idea. Are these assertions lies?


I don't get early access to all the evidence in a criminal case. Most prosecutors just turn over the file, but some try to hide the ball as long as possible. One thing that is a common thread in my experience is that most people think the criminal justice system provides far more rights and protections than it does. I blame TV, and certain political interests that want people to think accused criminals are being coddled.

The lawyer thing depends on the context. I suspect it is either overblown or the school needs straightened out.

Lies? Have no idea. They are being told from a certain point of view though, and in my experience for every one legitimate complaint about any system of this type there are ten people who are mad to the point their perspective is not all that trustworthy. Personal anecdotes about being screwed over are something I've learned to comprehensively scrutinize rather than take at face value.

I'm sure some falsely accused persons are getting screwed over. I think the concern over this, especially by men, is that the idea of a false accusation is absolutely terrifying in a relatable way, whereas the experience of being sexually assaulted and having the person doing it go free is not.

In a non-criminal context, these are equally valid interests. Weighing them equally isn't going to be easy. Some colleges will have to be sued.

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Re: #MeTo (TITLE IX edition)

Postby Grammatron » Wed Dec 27, 2017 6:58 pm

RCC: Act II wrote:
Grammatron wrote:
RCC: Act II wrote:Not fully. The criminal system is about punishment, the civil is about redressing harm and making a victim whole, and the college system is about campus safety and how that relates to education access.

Three different interests served by three different types of proceedings.


That's very noble and all but the victims tend to the accused.


I'm not being snarky, but I'm assuming there is a word or two missing from that and I'm not clear of the meaning.

If it is the word "be" between "to" and "the", my response is that I live in a reality where false accusations of sexual assault are way, way less in number than are campus sexual assaults.


The word is indeed "be" but your conclusion is not my claim. When it came to Title IX investigations, the victims tended to be the accused.
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Re: #MeTo (TITLE IX edition)

Postby Skeeve » Thu Dec 28, 2017 1:12 pm

ed wrote:I wonder if suc proceedings are violations of human rights? Wonder if you could get redress in the Hague?

From the recent anecdote article...
...
...it is clear that the Obama administration rightly viewed campus assault overwhelmingly as something male students do to female ones.
...
Pressing schools to improve what were sometimes haphazard procedures surrounding sexual-assault allegations; to provide clear rules about what constitutes consent and to publicize those rules on campus; and to encourage students to look out for one another—these were all worthy ends. Biden said regularly that one sexual assault is too many, and that is inarguably true.

Yet from the beginning, the administration’s efforts showed signs of overreach, and that overreach became more pronounced over time. By early 2014, the terminology used by the federal government to describe the two parties in still-unresolved sexual-assault cases had begun to change. The 2011 “Dear Colleague” letter had used the terms complainant (and sometimes alleged victim) and alleged perpetrator. But many subsequent federal documents described a complainant as a victim or a survivor, and the accused as a perpetrator.

Now where have I seen that before...

https://www.theatlantic.com/education/a ... cy/538974/
Then Skank Of America could start in...


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