2018 USA election thread.

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2018 USA election thread.

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Tue Mar 06, 2018 6:20 pm

OK I'll kick things off with some conditional speculation.

The usual way things go, the party not in power gains.

Should that not happen this time, the Democrats will blame the Russians.
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Re: 2018 USA election thread.

Post by shemp » Wed Mar 07, 2018 3:50 am

I predict that once again, regardless of the outcome, the voters will get screwed.
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Re: 2018 USA election thread.

Post by gnome » Wed Mar 07, 2018 2:13 pm

I predict the Democrats will get nowhere if they don't find something to talk about besides guns once the campaign season is in full swing.

I've never quite understood the strategy--they consistently lose ground on the issue, and rather than expediently shelving the issue in favor of others, or even trying to adapt the narrative to score better with it, they come back to the same losing playbook over and over again.

For all the talk of "Obama's coming for your guns", I perceive it was kind of a lower key issue during his presidency compared to other times.
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Re: 2018 USA election thread.

Post by Giz » Wed Mar 07, 2018 2:18 pm

gnome wrote:
I've never quite understood the strategy--they consistently lose ground on the issue, and rather than expediently shelving the issue in favor of others, or even trying to adapt the narrative to score better with it, they come back to the same losing playbook over and over again.

.
It's group think. Everyone they know is outraged on this issue. And it riles up their base (can I get an ooo-rah! ?). And it promises punishment to their opponents base.

Effectiveness (whether of reducing violence or getting elected) be damned.

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Re: 2018 USA election thread.

Post by gnome » Wed Mar 07, 2018 2:42 pm

I even question its impact on enough of the base. There is a certain amount, but it's often hard to find people (even among those sympathetic) who buy the entire line. Of course, maybe that's because I live in Florida.
"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight! Sun Tzu said that, and I'd say he knows a little bit more about fighting than you do, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living man could best him in the ring of honor. Then, he used his fight money to buy two of every animal on earth, and then he herded them onto a boat, and then he beat the crap out of every single one. And from that day forward any time a bunch of animals are together in one place it's called a zoo! (Beat) Unless it's a farm!"
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Re: 2018 USA election thread.

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Wed Mar 07, 2018 2:45 pm

gnome wrote:I predict the Democrats will get nowhere if they don't find something to talk about besides guns once the campaign season is in full swing.
Guns and Russians.
I've never quite understood the strategy--they consistently lose ground on the issue, and rather than expediently shelving the issue in favor of others, or even trying to adapt the narrative to score better with it, they come back to the same losing playbook over and over again.

For all the talk of "Obama's coming for your guns", I perceive it was kind of a lower key issue during his presidency compared to other times.
In some sense LIBBERULz are always coming for your guns, but with Obama as president not so much in particular.

The traditional Democratic Party line about increasing employment has been partially co-opted by Trump (even though he's anti-union).
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Re: 2018 USA election thread.

Post by ed » Wed Mar 07, 2018 3:00 pm

Guns, webacks and Russians: three democratic non-starters.

Funny thing is that they know about the first two and saying it louder is not really a change in strategy.
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Re: 2018 USA election thread.

Post by gnome » Wed Mar 07, 2018 3:37 pm

They have potential on the immigration issue if they stick with the bipartisan line. That's popular despite the fact that it makes some of the right wing base REALLY mad.

More border security (with or without a "big wall") + making provision for DACA and they'll probably come out OK in that front.
"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight! Sun Tzu said that, and I'd say he knows a little bit more about fighting than you do, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living man could best him in the ring of honor. Then, he used his fight money to buy two of every animal on earth, and then he herded them onto a boat, and then he beat the crap out of every single one. And from that day forward any time a bunch of animals are together in one place it's called a zoo! (Beat) Unless it's a farm!"
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Re: 2018 USA election thread.

Post by Giz » Wed Mar 07, 2018 3:43 pm

gnome wrote:The

More border security (with or without a "big wall") +
That doesn't seem to be what their base or bigwigs want. (And who cares about the blue collar voters anyway?)

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Re: 2018 USA election thread.

Post by WildCat » Wed Mar 07, 2018 4:06 pm

gnome wrote:For all the talk of "Obama's coming for your guns", I perceive it was kind of a lower key issue during his presidency compared to other times.
That's because he didn't "come for the guns" until after his second election.
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Re: 2018 USA election thread.

Post by WildCat » Wed Mar 07, 2018 4:11 pm

gnome wrote:They have potential on the immigration issue if they stick with the bipartisan line. That's popular despite the fact that it makes some of the right wing base REALLY mad.

More border security (with or without a "big wall") + making provision for DACA and they'll probably come out OK in that front.
Democrats have no desire whatsoever for border security, they resist every effort in that direction. And in fact they fight for less border security, and even encourage non-citizens to vote even directly as of late to go along with their traditional method of making it impossible to enact or enforce laws preventing them from doing so.
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Re: 2018 USA election thread.

Post by gnome » Wed Mar 07, 2018 5:11 pm

I'm not thinking of what Democratic leaders want, I'm thinking of what will score with voters. What I described has significant support, I believe majority support and not by a fraction.
"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight! Sun Tzu said that, and I'd say he knows a little bit more about fighting than you do, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living man could best him in the ring of honor. Then, he used his fight money to buy two of every animal on earth, and then he herded them onto a boat, and then he beat the crap out of every single one. And from that day forward any time a bunch of animals are together in one place it's called a zoo! (Beat) Unless it's a farm!"
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Re: 2018 USA election thread.

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Wed Mar 07, 2018 5:22 pm

gnome wrote: ... what will score with voters ...
The party leadership stopped thinking in those terms around the year 2000.
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Re: 2018 USA election thread.

Post by Mentat » Wed Mar 07, 2018 5:40 pm

Democrats have been pounding the health care drum. And that has been quite a major role in recent elections.
It's "pea-can", man.

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Re: 2018 USA election thread.

Post by Skeeve » Wed Mar 07, 2018 6:00 pm

New Filing Shows Democratic National Committee is Basically Out of Money

Looks like (money wise at least) the Democrats won't do so well this time around....

Democratic National Committee fundraising hits wall as GOP sits flush ahead of midterm elections

Okay, I will stick my prophetic neck out and say the GOP will pick up a few....
Then Skank Of America could start in...

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Re: 2018 USA election thread.

Post by ed » Wed Mar 07, 2018 6:08 pm

gnome wrote:They have potential on the immigration issue if they stick with the bipartisan line. That's popular despite the fact that it makes some of the right wing base REALLY mad.

More border security (with or without a "big wall") + making provision for DACA and they'll probably come out OK in that front.

Yeah but but but

Are they willing to repudiate Sanctuary Cities? That is a big big non-starter.

Maybe we can just let Cali secede.
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Re: 2018 USA election thread.

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Wed Mar 07, 2018 6:38 pm

ed wrote:Are they willing to repudiate Sanctuary Cities?
Not if they want votes in those cities. And I don't just mean from illegal aliens.
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Re: 2018 USA election thread.

Post by Giz » Wed Mar 07, 2018 7:08 pm

Abdul Alhazred wrote:
ed wrote:Are they willing to repudiate Sanctuary Cities?
Not if they want votes in those cities. And I don't just mean from illegal aliens.
Heck, maybe they are just playing the long game?

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Re: 2018 USA election thread.

Post by ed » Wed Mar 07, 2018 7:18 pm

That is exactly it.

Ask Rahm Emanuel. Only way he will get reelected is by having illegals vote.

Hence the new Chi ID card.
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Re: 2018 USA election thread.

Post by gnome » Wed Mar 07, 2018 8:22 pm

Abdul Alhazred wrote:
ed wrote:Are they willing to repudiate Sanctuary Cities?
Not if they want votes in those cities. And I don't just mean from illegal aliens.
I dunno. Honestly I think they could--if they shaped their own narrative on what constituted a "Sanctuary City," and deconstructed it a bit. Propose a clear standard on what local authorities are obligated to do and what they are not, possibly even brokering agreements in major cities under that dispute. Make the concept obsolete.
"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight! Sun Tzu said that, and I'd say he knows a little bit more about fighting than you do, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living man could best him in the ring of honor. Then, he used his fight money to buy two of every animal on earth, and then he herded them onto a boat, and then he beat the crap out of every single one. And from that day forward any time a bunch of animals are together in one place it's called a zoo! (Beat) Unless it's a farm!"
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