Chris murphy comes out for repealing the first amendment

Lies, damned lies, and statistics.
User avatar
RCC: Act II
Posts: 814
Joined: Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:56 am
Has thanked: 8 times
Been thanked: 82 times

Re: Chris murphy comes out for repealing the first amendment

Post by RCC: Act II » Thu Aug 09, 2018 3:53 pm

Abdul Alhazred wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 3:44 pm
I will stipulate he really is a performance artist (who are we to say what is an "artist").

The point is, that's still no excuse.

As George Orwell at different times wrote of Salvador Dali and Ezra Pound, one has the right to expect ordinary human decency even from an artist.
He's absolutely a walking piece of trash and the only reason he isn't in prison is that the laws governing incitement and harassment haven't remotely caught up with the issues created by the internet. Not to mention the absolutist free-speech ethos that developed back when there were barriers of access to the web that caused it to be used by mostly educated and well-meaning people.

User avatar
Abdul Alhazred
Posts: 69767
Joined: Mon Jun 07, 2004 1:33 pm
Title: Yes, that one.
Location: Chicago
Has thanked: 2851 times
Been thanked: 1093 times

Re: Chris murphy comes out for repealing the first amendment

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Thu Aug 09, 2018 3:57 pm

Incitement?

I remember when "incitement to riot" charges were used to suppress dissent in the 1960s.
But at least there were some actual riots going around.
Image "If I turn in a sicko, will I get a reward?"

"Yes! A BIG REWARD!" ====> Click here to turn in a sicko
Any man writes a mission statement spends a night in the box.
-- our mission statement plappendale

User avatar
Anaxagoras
Posts: 20935
Joined: Wed Mar 19, 2008 5:45 am
Location: Yokohama/Tokyo, Japan
Has thanked: 1330 times
Been thanked: 1110 times

Re: Chris murphy comes out for repealing the first amendment

Post by Anaxagoras » Thu Aug 09, 2018 4:03 pm

WildCat wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 3:48 pm
Anaxagoras wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 12:24 pm
Oh lord.

Poor fucking (insert name of rapist murderer who was lynched). Fucking martyr for our freedumbs.
Fixed.
You're right. Being hung from your neck until dead and being banned from Facebook are basically the same thing.
A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool.
William Shakespeare

User avatar
Giz
Posts: 857
Joined: Mon Jul 12, 2004 5:07 pm
Location: UK
Has thanked: 99 times
Been thanked: 170 times

Re: Chris murphy comes out for repealing the first amendment

Post by Giz » Thu Aug 09, 2018 4:04 pm

Abdul Alhazred wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 3:49 pm
But I would say The New York Times is much worse than Alex Jones.

Nobody with any sense ever cared about what Alex Jones says, and plenty of better than average informed people never even heard of him before the mainstream story about the social media bannings.

Whereas The New York Times is burning down its long standing reputation for reliability and respectability to spread lies and hatred.
It's not that the NY Times is worse than Alex Jones (it's not). It's that what is happening to it is a greater loss to society.

User avatar
Doctor X
Posts: 66652
Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2004 8:09 pm
Title: Collective Messiah
Location: Your Mom
Has thanked: 3232 times
Been thanked: 2045 times

Re: Chris murphy comes out for repealing the first amendment

Post by Doctor X » Thu Aug 09, 2018 4:05 pm

Anaxagoras wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 12:24 pm
Poor fucking Alex. Fucking martyr for our freedumbs.
He gave his buck-o-five, Anax.

Image

--J.D.
Mob of the Mean: Free beanie, cattle-prod and Charley Fan Club!
"Doctor X is just treating you the way he treats everyone--as subhuman crap too dumb to breathe in after you breathe out."--Don
DocX: FTW.--sparks
"Doctor X wins again."--Pyrrho
"Never sorry to make a racist Fucktard cry."--His Humble MagNIfIcence
"It was the criticisms of Doc X, actually, that let me see more clearly how far the hypocrisy had gone."--clarsct
"I'd leave it up to Doctor X who has been a benevolent tyrant so far."--Grammatron
"Indeed you are a river to your people.
Shit. That's going to end up in your sig."--Pyrrho
"Try a twelve step program and accept Doctor X as your High Power."--asthmatic camel
"just like Doc X said." --gnome

WS CHAMPIONS X3!!! NBA CHAMPIONS!! Stanley Cup! SB CHAMPIONS X5!!!!!
34

User avatar
ed
Posts: 32588
Joined: Tue Jun 08, 2004 11:52 pm
Title: Rhino of the Florida swamp
Has thanked: 424 times
Been thanked: 705 times

Re: Chris murphy comes out for repealing the first amendment

Post by ed » Thu Aug 09, 2018 4:15 pm

RCC: Act II wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 3:53 pm
Not to mention the absolutist free-speech ethos that developed back when there were barriers of access to the web that caused it to be used by mostly educated and well-meaning people.
So what should the governmentally sanctioned speech on the net include and what should it reject?
- new minimalist ethos -

User avatar
WildCat
Posts: 13546
Joined: Tue Jun 15, 2004 2:53 am
Location: The 33rd Ward, Chicago
Has thanked: 29 times
Been thanked: 285 times

Re: Chris murphy comes out for repealing the first amendment

Post by WildCat » Thu Aug 09, 2018 4:53 pm

RCC: Act II wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 3:53 pm
Not to mention the absolutist free-speech ethos that developed back when there were barriers of access to the web that caused it to be used by mostly educated and well-meaning people.
Yes, we can't have the hoi polloi speaking freely on the internet, the horror!

Only rich white progressives and a select few people of color who tow their line should enjoy free speech.
Do you have questions about God?

you sniveling little right-wing nutter - jj

User avatar
WildCat
Posts: 13546
Joined: Tue Jun 15, 2004 2:53 am
Location: The 33rd Ward, Chicago
Has thanked: 29 times
Been thanked: 285 times

Re: Chris murphy comes out for repealing the first amendment

Post by WildCat » Thu Aug 09, 2018 4:55 pm

Anaxagoras wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 4:03 pm
WildCat wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 3:48 pm
Anaxagoras wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 12:24 pm
Oh lord.

Poor fucking (insert name of rapist murderer who was lynched). Fucking martyr for our freedumbs.
Fixed.
You're right. Being hung from your neck until dead and being banned from Facebook are basically the same thing.
Great point, only when the loss of rights leads directly to death is it important to defend them.
Do you have questions about God?

you sniveling little right-wing nutter - jj

User avatar
RCC: Act II
Posts: 814
Joined: Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:56 am
Has thanked: 8 times
Been thanked: 82 times

Re: Chris murphy comes out for repealing the first amendment

Post by RCC: Act II » Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:12 pm

ed wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 4:15 pm
RCC: Act II wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 3:53 pm
Not to mention the absolutist free-speech ethos that developed back when there were barriers of access to the web that caused it to be used by mostly educated and well-meaning people.
So what should the governmentally sanctioned speech on the net include and what should it reject?
This is a nonsensical response.

User avatar
Grammatron
Posts: 33062
Joined: Tue Jun 08, 2004 1:21 am
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Been thanked: 1620 times

Re: Chris murphy comes out for repealing the first amendment

Post by Grammatron » Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:15 pm

Can't we not agree that Alex Jones is a charlatan and no one would probably shed a tear if he accidentally falls balls first into a woodchipper but that doesn't mean can't have a conversation about platforms and their power?

User avatar
WildCat
Posts: 13546
Joined: Tue Jun 15, 2004 2:53 am
Location: The 33rd Ward, Chicago
Has thanked: 29 times
Been thanked: 285 times

Re: Chris murphy comes out for repealing the first amendment

Post by WildCat » Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:15 pm

RCC: Act II wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:12 pm
ed wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 4:15 pm
RCC: Act II wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 3:53 pm
Not to mention the absolutist free-speech ethos that developed back when there were barriers of access to the web that caused it to be used by mostly educated and well-meaning people.
So what should the governmentally sanctioned speech on the net include and what should it reject?
This is a nonsensical response.
The elitist white arbiter of The Truth has spoken.
Do you have questions about God?

you sniveling little right-wing nutter - jj

User avatar
RCC: Act II
Posts: 814
Joined: Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:56 am
Has thanked: 8 times
Been thanked: 82 times

Re: Chris murphy comes out for repealing the first amendment

Post by RCC: Act II » Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:17 pm

WildCat wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 4:53 pm
RCC: Act II wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 3:53 pm
Not to mention the absolutist free-speech ethos that developed back when there were barriers of access to the web that caused it to be used by mostly educated and well-meaning people.
Yes, we can't have the hoi polloi speaking freely on the internet, the horror!

Only rich white progressives and a select few people of color who tow their line should enjoy free speech.
If by "speaking freely" you mean "using the internet to coordinate a massive and sustained campaign of intense harassment against families who lost children in a school shooting" then yeah, that's bad.

User avatar
RCC: Act II
Posts: 814
Joined: Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:56 am
Has thanked: 8 times
Been thanked: 82 times

Re: Chris murphy comes out for repealing the first amendment

Post by RCC: Act II » Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:19 pm

Grammatron wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:15 pm
Can't we not agree that Alex Jones is a charlatan and no one would probably shed a tear if he accidentally falls balls first into a woodchipper but that doesn't mean can't have a conversation about platforms and their power?
Sure. Only that his level of evil informs the discussion as a handy reference point.

User avatar
Grammatron
Posts: 33062
Joined: Tue Jun 08, 2004 1:21 am
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Been thanked: 1620 times

Re: Chris murphy comes out for repealing the first amendment

Post by Grammatron » Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:26 pm

RCC: Act II wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:19 pm
Grammatron wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:15 pm
Can't we not agree that Alex Jones is a charlatan and no one would probably shed a tear if he accidentally falls balls first into a woodchipper but that doesn't mean can't have a conversation about platforms and their power?
Sure. Only that his level of evil informs the discussion as a handy reference point.
I don't see how.

User avatar
RCC: Act II
Posts: 814
Joined: Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:56 am
Has thanked: 8 times
Been thanked: 82 times

Re: Chris murphy comes out for repealing the first amendment

Post by RCC: Act II » Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:37 pm

Grammatron wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:26 pm
RCC: Act II wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:19 pm
Grammatron wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:15 pm
Can't we not agree that Alex Jones is a charlatan and no one would probably shed a tear if he accidentally falls balls first into a woodchipper but that doesn't mean can't have a conversation about platforms and their power?
Sure. Only that his level of evil informs the discussion as a handy reference point.
I don't see how.
I don't see how there can be a discussion of the balancing of free speech interests against other interests without any sort of example of how speech can cause tangible harm. I'm sure there are others, but the parents of the Sandy Hood massacre being hounded by morons is a pretty good example of the kinds of harm at issue.

Free speech absolutism falls apart when the claim of "the cure to speech is more speech" is applied to these kinds of real world situations. It only works in the abstract.

User avatar
sparks
Posts: 13665
Joined: Fri Oct 26, 2007 4:13 pm
Location: Friar McWallclocks Bar -- Where time stands still while you lean over!
Has thanked: 1746 times
Been thanked: 557 times

Re: Chris murphy comes out for repealing the first amendment

Post by sparks » Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:40 pm

Oh good christ.

WildCunt has crossed the line with me.

"Freedom of the press" in the 1A is not a reference to institutional news media. "

" Anaxagoras wrote: ↑
Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:24 am
Oh lord.

Poor fucking (insert name of rapist murderer who was lynched). Fucking martyr for our freedumbs.

Fixed."

No.

Just fucked. (Insert Mom joke here)

I hereby censor, and with extreme prejudice, WildCunts ability to appear on my confuser.!!11Eleventy. In the name of Nyar, I hereby ban and ignore you, WildCunt, for crimes and high treason against the reasoning ability of our species!!11 :) :)

And in spite of the Rethuglicunt Party, and the chaos and division for which it stands, and all others who hate Obamacare but who love the Affordable Care Act without having read ... anything ... except the tattoo on your Moms port side butt cheek... which glorifies in being "Really drunk at the time". And other shit.

"There are none so blind as those who will not see." (Citation needed, no time now, watching a rerun of "The Sand Pebbles", which is far more significant than anything WildCunt may post in the future, certainly anything he's posted in the past. Cunt is just not worth the inconvenience to the electrons involved :) )
Last edited by sparks on Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
You can lead them to knowledge, but you can't make them think.

User avatar
Grammatron
Posts: 33062
Joined: Tue Jun 08, 2004 1:21 am
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Been thanked: 1620 times

Re: Chris murphy comes out for repealing the first amendment

Post by Grammatron » Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:43 pm

RCC: Act II wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:37 pm
I don't see how there can be a discussion of the balancing of free speech interests against other interests without any sort of example of how speech can cause tangible harm.
Isn't that what happens in every free speech discussions in courts, all the way up to SCOTUS?
I'm sure there are others, but the parents of the Sandy Hood massacre being hounded by morons is a pretty good example of the kinds of harm at issue.
Then prosecute the morons.
Free speech absolutism falls apart when the claim of "the cure to speech is more speech" is applied to these kinds of real world situations. It only works in the abstract.
Are you also advocating ban on rap music because of the real world situations in Chicago?
Last edited by Grammatron on Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
ed
Posts: 32588
Joined: Tue Jun 08, 2004 11:52 pm
Title: Rhino of the Florida swamp
Has thanked: 424 times
Been thanked: 705 times

Re: Chris murphy comes out for repealing the first amendment

Post by ed » Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:47 pm

RCC: Act II wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:12 pm
ed wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 4:15 pm
RCC: Act II wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 3:53 pm
Not to mention the absolutist free-speech ethos that developed back when there were barriers of access to the web that caused it to be used by mostly educated and well-meaning people.
So what should the governmentally sanctioned speech on the net include and what should it reject?
This is a nonsensical response.
Bullshit.

What do you mean by the phrase "absolutist free-speech ethos" and was your comment not critical? If so what do you propose. If it is a simple observation with no judgement implied them my reply was a son sequitur.

You should have a glass of cranberry juice.
- new minimalist ethos -

User avatar
RCC: Act II
Posts: 814
Joined: Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:56 am
Has thanked: 8 times
Been thanked: 82 times

Re: Chris murphy comes out for repealing the first amendment

Post by RCC: Act II » Thu Aug 09, 2018 6:01 pm

Grammatron wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:43 pm
RCC: Act II wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:37 pm
I don't see how there can be a discussion of the balancing of free speech interests against other interests without any sort of example of how speech can cause tangible harm.
Isn't that what every free speech discussion happen in court all the way up to SCOTUS?
Cases do tend to involve real world facts, yes.
I'm sure there are others, but the parents of the Sandy Hood massacre being hounded by morons is a pretty good example of the kinds of harm at issue.
Then prosecute the morons.
Yeah, that would be nice to do, which is the point here.
Free speech absolutism falls apart when the claim of "the cure to speech is more speech" is applied to these kinds of real world situations. It only works in the abstract.
Are you also advocating ban on rap music because of the real world situations in Chicago?
Ah, is this where we conflate violent imagery in art with speech directed to knowingly create harm against identifiable people?

User avatar
WildCat
Posts: 13546
Joined: Tue Jun 15, 2004 2:53 am
Location: The 33rd Ward, Chicago
Has thanked: 29 times
Been thanked: 285 times

Re: Chris murphy comes out for repealing the first amendment

Post by WildCat » Thu Aug 09, 2018 6:14 pm

sparks wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:40 pm
Oh good christ.

WildCunt has crossed the line with me.

"Freedom of the press" in the 1A is not a reference to institutional news media. "
It's not, and no court has ever ruled that it is. In fact the courts have made clear that institutional news media and the journalists they employ have no more 1st Amendment rights than anyone else.

The most recent affirmation of that is the 9th Circuit ruling in Padrick v. Cox, where the justices wrote:
The protections of the First Amendment do not turn on whether the defendant was a trained journalist, formally affiliated with traditional news entities, engaged in conflict-of-interest disclosure, went beyond just assembling others' writings, or tried to get both sides of a story. As the Supreme Court has accurately warned, a First Amendment distinction between the institutional press and other speakers is unworkable: “With the advent of the Internet and the decline of print and broadcast media ․ the line between the media and others who wish to comment on political and social issues becomes far more blurred.” Citizens United, 558 U.S. at 352.
Last edited by WildCat on Thu Aug 09, 2018 6:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Do you have questions about God?

you sniveling little right-wing nutter - jj