ACLU's Opposition to Kavanaugh Sounds Its Death Knell

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ACLU's Opposition to Kavanaugh Sounds Its Death Knell

Post by ed » Sun Oct 07, 2018 11:47 am

Not your typical screed. This thoughtful piece is written by Alan Dershowitz. If you don't know of him mores the pity. I remember him from years gone by when he was a supporter of lefty causes. I always liked the guy because he had seemed principled. Nowadays his criticisms are leveled in directions that are somewhat unexpected but not so much if you followed the guy over the years. A am sure Abdul has some thoughts and I'd be curious to hear them.

Anyway, an interesting article from a guy who was "there".
ACLU's Opposition to Kavanaugh Sounds Its Death Knell
by Alan M. Dershowitz
October 6, 2018 at 4:00 pm

So why did the American Civil Liberties Union oppose a Republican nominee to the Supreme Court and argue for a presumption of guilt regarding sexual allegations directed against that judicial nominee? The answer is as clear as it is simple. It is all about pleasing the donors. The ACLU used to be cash poor but principle-rich. Now, ironically, after Trump taking office, the ACLU has never become so cash-rich, yet principle-poor.

The problem is that most of the money is not coming from civil libertarians who care about free speech, due process, the rights of the accused and defending the unpopular. It is coming from radical leftists in Hollywood, Silicon Valley and other areas not known for a deep commitment to civil liberties.

The old ACLU would never have been silent when Michael Cohen's office was raided by the FBI and his clients' files seized; it would have yelled foul when students accused of sexual misconduct were tried by kangaroo courts; and it surely would have argued against a presumption of guilt regarding sexual allegations directed against a judicial nominee.
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Re: ACLU's Opposition to Kavanaugh Sounds Its Death Knell

Post by Skeeve » Sun Oct 07, 2018 2:07 pm

...
There appears to be a direct correlation between the ACLU's fundraising and its priorities. When the ACLU's national political director and former Democratic Party operative Faiz Shakir was asked why the ACLU got involved in the Kavanaugh confirmation fight, he freely admitted, "People have funded us and I think they expect a return." Its funders applaud the result because many of these mega donors could not care less about genuine civil liberties or due process. What they care about are political results: more left-wing Democrats in Congress, fewer conservative justices on the Supreme Court and more money in the ACLU coffers.
Spoken like a politician....
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Re: ACLU's Opposition to Kavanaugh Sounds Its Death Knell

Post by Giz » Sun Oct 07, 2018 2:14 pm

Unfortunately, it probably just means that the illiberal left will leverage the ACLU’s previously good name for bad ends. And the MSM won’t call them on it, so any push back will sound like haters railing against a hallowed civil rights organization.

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Re: ACLU's Opposition to Kavanaugh Sounds Its Death Knell

Post by Skeeve » Sun Oct 07, 2018 3:08 pm

Giz wrote:
Sun Oct 07, 2018 2:14 pm
Unfortunately, it probably just means that the illiberal left will leverage the ACLU’s previously good name for bad ends. And the MSM won’t call them on it, so any push back will sound like haters railing against a hallowed civil rights organization.
What happened to Alan Dershowitz?
NEW YORK — If you wanted to feel the full force of the intellectual whirlpool that is American politics in 2018, the place to go on April 2 was the Village Underground, a nightclub beneath West 3rd Street, where Alan Dershowitz, the longtime Harvard Law professor and civil liberties lion, was debating the future of American democracy on the side of President Donald Trump.
...
On our way out, my wife and I were handed free copies of Dershowitz’s newest book, “Trumped Up: How Criminalization of Political Differences Endangers Democracy,” in which Dershowitz writes that special prosecutor Robert Mueller is subjecting Trump to “the legal equivalent of a colonoscopy.”

The woman behind us in line took her free book, turned to her husband and asked, “What happened to Alan Dershowitz?”
...
Maybe the question isn’t what happened to Alan Dershowitz. Maybe it’s what happened to everyone else.
Seriously...
...
This point is central to Dershowitz, who sees the ACLU as having turned “away from traditional liberal values toward a ‘progressive’ politics.” The ACLU declined my requests for an interview for this story; its national legal director, David Cole, emailed only to say, “I think Alan Dershowitz is wildly overreacting” and to refer me to a blog post on the ACLU website in which he writes: “The ACLU is the nation’s premier defender of privacy. But we also believe in the rule of law as an essential foundation for civil liberties and civil rights. And perhaps the first principle of the rule of law is that no one—not even the president, let alone his lawyer—is above the law.”
Last edited by Skeeve on Sun Oct 07, 2018 3:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: ACLU's Opposition to Kavanaugh Sounds Its Death Knell

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Sun Oct 07, 2018 3:10 pm

Giz wrote:
Sun Oct 07, 2018 2:14 pm
Unfortunately, it probably just means that the illiberal left will leverage the ACLU’s previously good name for bad ends. ...
As they do with all institutions they co-opt.

The ACLU used to be good on "everything", except second amendment.
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Re: ACLU's Opposition to Kavanaugh Sounds Its Death Knell

Post by shuize » Sun Oct 07, 2018 4:43 pm

Abdul Alhazred wrote: The ACLU used to be good on "everything", except second amendment.
And that’s where they lost me.

Much like the Amnesty International woman I met in Japan. I’d always thought they did good work around the world, but when I tried to talk to her it was pure “America bad” politics and nothing else mattered. I walked away thinking, “If that’s what they’ve become, I’ll keep my money in my wallet.”

So too my brief time in the university union. When I started, I thought it was a good idea. But around the third time I received an “America out of Okinawa” screed as part of my Union newsletter, I realized they were a lot more interested in left wing politics than in improving my work situation.

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Re: ACLU's Opposition to Kavanaugh Sounds Its Death Knell

Post by Doctor X » Sun Oct 07, 2018 4:55 pm

Yeah, that.

But then it is hard to prevent organizations from becoming political.

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Re: ACLU's Opposition to Kavanaugh Sounds Its Death Knell

Post by WildCat » Sun Oct 07, 2018 5:26 pm

Doctor X wrote:
Sun Oct 07, 2018 4:55 pm
Yeah, that.

But then it is hard to prevent organizations from becoming political.

--J.D.
O'Sullivan's Law: Any organization or enterprise that is not expressly right wing will become left wing over time. This is because right wingers are willing to hire openly left-wing employees in the interest of fairness. Left-wingers, utterly intolerant, will not allow a non-Liberal near them, and will harass them at every opportunity. The result over time is that conservative enterprises are infiltrated by leftists but leftist enterprises remain the same or get worse.
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Re: ACLU's Opposition to Kavanaugh Sounds Its Death Knell

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Sun Oct 07, 2018 5:39 pm

The ACLU was always explicitly left wing.

It's just that things like freedom of speech and due process used to be OK by left wingers.
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Re: ACLU's Opposition to Kavanaugh Sounds Its Death Knell

Post by Giz » Sun Oct 07, 2018 6:29 pm

Abdul Alhazred wrote:
Sun Oct 07, 2018 5:39 pm
The ACLU was always explicitly left wing.

It's just that things like freedom of speech and due process used to be OK by left wingers.
Perhaps too cynical but I wonder whether those things used to be OK just because they were an out-group and it gave them benefits whilst they suffered no downside. Now they are in power (at least culturally) the concepts are no longer useful.

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Re: ACLU's Opposition to Kavanaugh Sounds Its Death Knell

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Sun Oct 07, 2018 6:45 pm

Giz wrote:
Sun Oct 07, 2018 6:29 pm
Abdul Alhazred wrote:
Sun Oct 07, 2018 5:39 pm
The ACLU was always explicitly left wing.

It's just that things like freedom of speech and due process used to be OK by left wingers.
Perhaps too cynical but I wonder whether those things used to be OK just because they were an out-group and it gave them benefits whilst they suffered no downside. Now they are in power (at least culturally) the concepts are no longer useful.
In the 1960s and 1970s, they were no out group.

Those things really are good for everybody, it's not big deal altruism to be for (especially) due process.
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Re: ACLU's Opposition to Kavanaugh Sounds Its Death Knell

Post by Doctor X » Sun Oct 07, 2018 7:00 pm

They have made Trump a Great Satan to an extent greater than Psycho-Cons made Obama. I suspect they would have done the same with Her Turn with investigations into collusion, Benghazi 2.02 Electric Boogaloo, Uranium One, and whatever else they could find running continuously.

One difference is the Hiltards--see what I did there? I am such a card!--would be worshiping her Her excrement blindly in the name of "feminism"--wrap your mind around that--the same as minorities swooned over Obama as he gave no shit about them. Unlike Trump, I only expect Her Turn would screech a speech or two rather than daily embarrass hHerself on Twitter. So unlike Trump supporters, hHers [Stop it!--Ed.] would feel less personal embarrassment supporting her.

Finally, there would not be roving bands of Pissed Off Conservatives waiting to do violence on the Hiltards.

Other than that Mrs. Lincoln. . . .

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Re: ACLU's Opposition to Kavanaugh Sounds Its Death Knell

Post by ed » Sun Oct 07, 2018 7:07 pm

Doctor X wrote:
Sun Oct 07, 2018 7:00 pm

Finally, there would not be roving bands of Pissed Off Conservatives waiting to do violence on the Hiltards.



--J.D.
Think it will come to that?

Soon?
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Re: ACLU's Opposition to Kavanaugh Sounds Its Death Knell

Post by Doctor X » Sun Oct 07, 2018 7:27 pm

Not long after Andy [Ferguson--Ed.] and I met, we were driving down Pennsylvania Avenue and encountered some or another noisy pinko demonstration. "How come," I asked Andy, "whenever something upsets the Left, you see immediate marches and parades and rallies with signs already printed and rhyming slogans already composed, whereas whenever something upsets the Right, you see two members of the Young Americans for Freedom waving a six-inch American flag.?"

"We have jobs," said Andy.

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Re: ACLU's Opposition to Kavanaugh Sounds Its Death Knell

Post by ed » Sun Oct 07, 2018 7:30 pm

Point taken.
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Re: ACLU's Opposition to Kavanaugh Sounds Its Death Knell

Post by Giz » Sun Oct 07, 2018 7:51 pm

ed wrote:
Sun Oct 07, 2018 7:07 pm
Doctor X wrote:
Sun Oct 07, 2018 7:00 pm

Finally, there would not be roving bands of Pissed Off Conservatives waiting to do violence on the Hiltards.



--J.D.
Think it will come to that?

Soon?
You mean, like GOP congressmen gunned down during, say, a baseball game? And then the media slams Trump for encouraging violence against his opponents?

Nah, too stupidly dystopian.

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Re: ACLU's Opposition to Kavanaugh Sounds Its Death Knell

Post by Doctor X » Sun Oct 07, 2018 8:16 pm

Those were not True Leftists/Democrats, Giz.

Besides, you need to understand that they are justifiably upset.

--J.D.
Mob of the Mean: Free beanie, cattle-prod and Charley Fan Club!
"Doctor X is just treating you the way he treats everyone--as subhuman crap too dumb to breathe in after you breathe out."--Don
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"Doctor X wins again."--Pyrrho
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"It was the criticisms of Doc X, actually, that let me see more clearly how far the hypocrisy had gone."--clarsct
"I'd leave it up to Doctor X who has been a benevolent tyrant so far."--Grammatron
"Indeed you are a river to your people.
Shit. That's going to end up in your sig."--Pyrrho
"Try a twelve step program and accept Doctor X as your High Power."--asthmatic camel
"just like Doc X said." --gnome

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Re: ACLU's Opposition to Kavanaugh Sounds Its Death Knell

Post by corplinx » Sun Oct 07, 2018 9:21 pm

Abdul Alhazred wrote:
Sun Oct 07, 2018 5:39 pm
The ACLU was always explicitly left wing.

It's just that things like freedom of speech and due process used to be OK by left wingers.

Post Trotsky leftists were mainly concerned with the government silencing them.

Now the ACLU is beholden to "liberal" Democrats.