Trump Vows To End Birthright Citizenship With Executive Order

Lies, damned lies, and statistics.
User avatar
Skeeve
Posts: 10447
Joined: Wed Jun 09, 2004 7:35 am
Has thanked: 61 times
Been thanked: 79 times

Trump Vows To End Birthright Citizenship With Executive Order

Post by Skeeve » Tue Oct 30, 2018 2:15 pm

Trump Vows To End Birthright Citizenship With Executive Order
President Trump plans to end the "ridiculous" policy that grants automatic citizenship rights of children born in the U.S. to illegal immigrants or non-citizens.

In an interview with Axios, Trump said he hopes to enact an executive order to revoke the practice of giving citizenship to what are known as "anchor babies."

"We're the only country in the world where a person comes in and has a baby, and the baby is essentially a citizen of the United States... with all of those benefits. It's ridiculous. It's ridiculous. And it has to end," the president said.
Well, if that is true, he may just have a point...
I find it a bit hard to believe we are the ONLY country that does this though....
Then Skank Of America could start in...

User avatar
Abdul Alhazred
Posts: 71323
Joined: Mon Jun 07, 2004 1:33 pm
Title: Yes, that one.
Location: Chicago
Has thanked: 3291 times
Been thanked: 1217 times

Re: Trump Vows To End Birthright Citizenship With Executive Order

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Tue Oct 30, 2018 2:45 pm

He may "vow" all he wants, but he will not get a constitutional amendment.

And I do not believe the reports that he will issue an EO.

Just a little something to get "the base" riled up before the election.
Last edited by Abdul Alhazred on Tue Oct 30, 2018 4:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Image "If I turn in a sicko, will I get a reward?"

"Yes! A BIG REWARD!" ====> Click here to turn in a sicko
Any man writes a mission statement spends a night in the box.
-- our mission statement plappendale

User avatar
ed
Posts: 33263
Joined: Tue Jun 08, 2004 11:52 pm
Title: Rhino of the Florida swamp
Has thanked: 450 times
Been thanked: 775 times

Re: Trump Vows To End Birthright Citizenship With Executive Order

Post by ed » Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:12 pm

Not sure that he can "EO" this. I think the constitution refers to "natural born".
Agree with Mr. Modulo on this.
Wenn ich Kultur höre, entsichere ich meinen Browning!

User avatar
Nyarlathotep
Posts: 47675
Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2004 2:50 pm
Has thanked: 782 times
Been thanked: 1458 times

Re: Trump Vows To End Birthright Citizenship With Executive Order

Post by Nyarlathotep » Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:24 pm

Skeeve wrote:
Tue Oct 30, 2018 2:15 pm
I find it a bit hard to believe we are the ONLY country that does this though...
We are not. I know for a fact Canada does it too. Probably some others, I dunno. But there is at least one other country that does this, making that statement a lie.
Bango Skank Awaits The Crimson King!

User avatar
Abdul Alhazred
Posts: 71323
Joined: Mon Jun 07, 2004 1:33 pm
Title: Yes, that one.
Location: Chicago
Has thanked: 3291 times
Been thanked: 1217 times

Re: Trump Vows To End Birthright Citizenship With Executive Order

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:37 pm

There are a few others. Not France, though.

Which goes to show that eliminating it will not solve our immigration problems.

It will only make us more like the French. :evil:
Image "If I turn in a sicko, will I get a reward?"

"Yes! A BIG REWARD!" ====> Click here to turn in a sicko
Any man writes a mission statement spends a night in the box.
-- our mission statement plappendale

User avatar
ed
Posts: 33263
Joined: Tue Jun 08, 2004 11:52 pm
Title: Rhino of the Florida swamp
Has thanked: 450 times
Been thanked: 775 times

Re: Trump Vows To End Birthright Citizenship With Executive Order

Post by ed » Tue Oct 30, 2018 4:14 pm

Here ya go
Unrestricted jus soli
Antigua and Barbuda: Guaranteed by the Constitution.[11][12]
Argentina[11]
Barbados: Guaranteed by the Constitution.[11][13] However, the Barbados Ministry of Labour & Immigration recently proposed ending automatic birthright citizenship.[14]
Belize[11][15]
Bolivia[11]
Brazil[11][16] (requires that the foreign parents are not working for their country's government in Brazil by the time the child is born).
Canada[11][17]
Chad [18][19] (The choice to take Chadian citizenship, or that of the parents is made at 18 years of age.)[20]
Chile[11][21]
Costa Rica[22] (requires registration with the Costa Rican government before the age of twenty-five)
Cuba[11]
Dominica[11][23]
Ecuador[11]
El Salvador[11]
Fiji[24]
Grenada[11]
Guatemala[11]
Guyana[11]
Honduras[11]
Jamaica[11][25]
Lesotho[26]
Mexico[11][27]
Nicaragua[11]
Pakistan[28][29]
Panama[11][30]
Paraguay[11]
Peru (registration required at 18 years of age)[11]
Saint Kitts and Nevis[11]
Saint Lucia[11]
Saint Vincent and the Grenadines[11]
Trinidad and Tobago [11][31]
Tuvalu[32]
United States: The 14th Amendment to the United States Constitution provides that "all persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside".[33] The phrase "subject to the jurisdiction thereof" excludes children born to foreign diplomats and children born to enemy forces engaged in hostile occupation of the country's territory.[34]
Uruguay[11][35]
Venezuela[11][36]
Shitholes, canada and us.

Get rid of it.
Wenn ich Kultur höre, entsichere ich meinen Browning!

User avatar
Abdul Alhazred
Posts: 71323
Joined: Mon Jun 07, 2004 1:33 pm
Title: Yes, that one.
Location: Chicago
Has thanked: 3291 times
Been thanked: 1217 times

Re: Trump Vows To End Birthright Citizenship With Executive Order

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Tue Oct 30, 2018 4:21 pm

Lots of people besides ed want to get rid of it, but constitutional amendments are difficult for good reason. Particularly ones that in effect required a civil war to get passed, previous to which citizenship was up to the states.

There is of course the legal argument that it was talking about freed slaves not children of resident aliens, but the case that established that application of it was back in the 19th century. So it's time for ed to post that pic of Fu Manchu again.
Image "If I turn in a sicko, will I get a reward?"

"Yes! A BIG REWARD!" ====> Click here to turn in a sicko
Any man writes a mission statement spends a night in the box.
-- our mission statement plappendale

User avatar
Pyrrho
Posts: 25947
Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2004 2:17 am
Title: Man in Black
Location: Division 6
Has thanked: 2721 times
Been thanked: 2783 times

Re: Trump Vows To End Birthright Citizenship With Executive Order

Post by Pyrrho » Tue Oct 30, 2018 4:41 pm

If a President is permitted to sign away one constitutional right, all such rights could be signed away.

No. Just no. It's wrong.
The flash of light you saw in the sky was not a UFO. Swamp gas from a weather balloon was trapped in a thermal pocket and reflected the light from Venus.

User avatar
Abdul Alhazred
Posts: 71323
Joined: Mon Jun 07, 2004 1:33 pm
Title: Yes, that one.
Location: Chicago
Has thanked: 3291 times
Been thanked: 1217 times

Re: Trump Vows To End Birthright Citizenship With Executive Order

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Tue Oct 30, 2018 4:46 pm

More n-dimensional Candyland in Hilbert space? :o
Image "If I turn in a sicko, will I get a reward?"

"Yes! A BIG REWARD!" ====> Click here to turn in a sicko
Any man writes a mission statement spends a night in the box.
-- our mission statement plappendale

User avatar
Skeeve
Posts: 10447
Joined: Wed Jun 09, 2004 7:35 am
Has thanked: 61 times
Been thanked: 79 times

Re: Trump Vows To End Birthright Citizenship With Executive Order

Post by Skeeve » Tue Oct 30, 2018 4:56 pm

ed wrote:
Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:12 pm
Not sure that he can "EO" this. I think the constitution refers to "natural born".
Agree with Mr. Modulo on this.
From the article...
...
But some argue that the Amendment, written in 1868, does not apply.
John Eastman, a constitutional scholar and director of Chapman University's Center for Constitutional Jurisprudence, told "Axios on HBO" that the Constitution has been misapplied over the past 40 or so years. He says the line "subject to the jurisdiction thereof" originally referred to people with full, political allegiance to the U.S. — green card holders and citizens.
And Trump, along with former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush, also asserted during the 2016 primaries that the phrase "subject to the jurisdiction" refers only to people with a legal right to be in the U.S.
Having said that, the article does seem to go on and agree with the both of you...
But with the midterm elections exactly one week away, the news of ending anchor babies is intended to play to Trump's conservative base.
and I agree also, nice bit of political pandering... now where did I put ahh there it is.

:Popcorn:
Then Skank Of America could start in...

User avatar
Pyrrho
Posts: 25947
Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2004 2:17 am
Title: Man in Black
Location: Division 6
Has thanked: 2721 times
Been thanked: 2783 times

Re: Trump Vows To End Birthright Citizenship With Executive Order

Post by Pyrrho » Tue Oct 30, 2018 5:08 pm

This President means what he says.
The flash of light you saw in the sky was not a UFO. Swamp gas from a weather balloon was trapped in a thermal pocket and reflected the light from Venus.

User avatar
corplinx
Posts: 20237
Joined: Tue Jan 29, 2008 12:49 am
Title: Moderator
Has thanked: 226 times
Been thanked: 679 times

Re: Trump Vows To End Birthright Citizenship With Executive Order

Post by corplinx » Tue Oct 30, 2018 5:08 pm

Image

User avatar
corplinx
Posts: 20237
Joined: Tue Jan 29, 2008 12:49 am
Title: Moderator
Has thanked: 226 times
Been thanked: 679 times

Re: Trump Vows To End Birthright Citizenship With Executive Order

Post by corplinx » Tue Oct 30, 2018 5:09 pm

On a serious note, H1B abuse is still rampant and one of the trends I've noticed is anchor babies within the H1B community.

I feel for female wives of H1B holders who might feel pressured to have a child before they are ready to exploit a loophole.

User avatar
Grammatron
Posts: 33560
Joined: Tue Jun 08, 2004 1:21 am
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Been thanked: 1741 times

Re: Trump Vows To End Birthright Citizenship With Executive Order

Post by Grammatron » Tue Oct 30, 2018 5:24 pm

Until the 1960s, the 14th Amendment was never applied to undocumented or temporary immigrants
This part is interesting and warrants more research.

User avatar
Abdul Alhazred
Posts: 71323
Joined: Mon Jun 07, 2004 1:33 pm
Title: Yes, that one.
Location: Chicago
Has thanked: 3291 times
Been thanked: 1217 times

Re: Trump Vows To End Birthright Citizenship With Executive Order

Post by Abdul Alhazred » Tue Oct 30, 2018 5:42 pm

Image "If I turn in a sicko, will I get a reward?"

"Yes! A BIG REWARD!" ====> Click here to turn in a sicko
Any man writes a mission statement spends a night in the box.
-- our mission statement plappendale

User avatar
Giz
Posts: 1243
Joined: Mon Jul 12, 2004 5:07 pm
Location: UK
Has thanked: 158 times
Been thanked: 269 times

Re: Trump Vows To End Birthright Citizenship With Executive Order

Post by Giz » Tue Oct 30, 2018 6:23 pm

Pyrrho wrote:
Tue Oct 30, 2018 4:41 pm
If a President is permitted to sign away one constitutional right, all such rights could be signed away.
.
This does seem to be the essence of it.

Constitutional checks and balances should be respected whether they aid or hinder us.

In the long run, it is the constitution and due process that determines whether we have a functioning society, far more than short term policies.

User avatar
Grammatron
Posts: 33560
Joined: Tue Jun 08, 2004 1:21 am
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Been thanked: 1741 times

Re: Trump Vows To End Birthright Citizenship With Executive Order

Post by Grammatron » Tue Oct 30, 2018 6:31 pm

Giz wrote:
Tue Oct 30, 2018 6:23 pm
Pyrrho wrote:
Tue Oct 30, 2018 4:41 pm
If a President is permitted to sign away one constitutional right, all such rights could be signed away.
.
This does seem to be the essence of it.

Constitutional checks and balances should be respected whether they aid or hinder us.

In the long run, it is the constitution and due process that determines whether we have a functioning society, far more than short term policies.
Indeed.

User avatar
ed
Posts: 33263
Joined: Tue Jun 08, 2004 11:52 pm
Title: Rhino of the Florida swamp
Has thanked: 450 times
Been thanked: 775 times

Re: Trump Vows To End Birthright Citizenship With Executive Order

Post by ed » Tue Oct 30, 2018 6:41 pm

Giz wrote:
Tue Oct 30, 2018 6:23 pm
Pyrrho wrote:
Tue Oct 30, 2018 4:41 pm
If a President is permitted to sign away one constitutional right, all such rights could be signed away.
.
This does seem to be the essence of it.

Constitutional checks and balances should be respected whether they aid or hinder us.

In the long run, it is the constitution and due process that determines whether we have a functioning society, far more than short term policies.
Well, let me ask you about due process. Do you have it with IRS?

Every time an agency (unelected) makes a "Rule" they skirt right next to the constitution. What about the shit that the dept of ed under oboma did to largely eliminate the rights of the accused to council and the presumption of innocence and all that stuff.
Wenn ich Kultur höre, entsichere ich meinen Browning!

User avatar
Grammatron
Posts: 33560
Joined: Tue Jun 08, 2004 1:21 am
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Been thanked: 1741 times

Re: Trump Vows To End Birthright Citizenship With Executive Order

Post by Grammatron » Tue Oct 30, 2018 6:45 pm

ed wrote:
Tue Oct 30, 2018 6:41 pm
Well, let me ask you about due process. Do you have it with IRS?
Yes.
Every time an agency (unelected) makes a "Rule" they skirt right next to the constitution. What about the shit that the dept of ed under oboma did to largely eliminate the rights of the accused to council and the presumption of innocence and all that stuff.
Just because the system works doesn't mean everything's instant.

User avatar
Giz
Posts: 1243
Joined: Mon Jul 12, 2004 5:07 pm
Location: UK
Has thanked: 158 times
Been thanked: 269 times

Re: Trump Vows To End Birthright Citizenship With Executive Order

Post by Giz » Tue Oct 30, 2018 6:48 pm

ed wrote:
Tue Oct 30, 2018 6:41 pm
Giz wrote:
Tue Oct 30, 2018 6:23 pm
Pyrrho wrote:
Tue Oct 30, 2018 4:41 pm
If a President is permitted to sign away one constitutional right, all such rights could be signed away.
.
This does seem to be the essence of it.

Constitutional checks and balances should be respected whether they aid or hinder us.

In the long run, it is the constitution and due process that determines whether we have a functioning society, far more than short term policies.
Well, let me ask you about due process. Do you have it with IRS?

Every time an agency (unelected) makes a "Rule" they skirt right next to the constitution. What about the shit that the dept of ed under oboma did to largely eliminate the rights of the accused to council and the presumption of innocence and all that stuff.
Then the answer is more due process, not less.

Obama governing poorly should not be used as an excuse for Trump governing poorly.


(Note: I am not against removing anchor baby citizenship. However, it must be done in a constitutional manner. If that makes it impossible, then maybe we have to live with it. Just like liberals have to live with the 2nd amendment. )