Ivermectin study questioned

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Anaxagoras
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Re: Ivermectin study questioned

Post by Anaxagoras »

Thanks Joe! ;)
Pyrrho
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Re: Ivermectin study questioned

Post by Pyrrho »

Some very technical explanations of the mechanism of action:

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41594-021-00651-0

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8110631/

A bit less technical:

https://www.statnews.com/2021/10/01/mer ... treatment/
Molnupiravir works in a manner different from other antiviral drugs, creating multiple errors in the virus’s RNA and impairing its ability to replicate. Because there is not much experience with this mechanism, Pavia said, safety data will need to be scrutinized. He also said he doubted the drug will be used in pregnant people. None were included in the study.

DNA sequencing data on which variant of the SARS-CoV-2 caused Covid-19 was available in 40% of the 81 cases. The drug appeared effective against so-called variants of concern, including the Gamma, Delta, and Mu variants of the virus.

“As you are well aware, it is likely that we’re going to see continued evolution of those variants,” said Li. “Our prediction from our in vitro studies and now with this data is that molnupiravir is named after the right — you know, it’s named after Thor’s hammer [Mjollnir], this is a hammer against SARS-CoV-2 regardless of the variant.”
Yes...efficacy is one thing...safety is another. Can't ignore the safety data, folks...and I'm sure most of us know about infamous "black box" warnings and drugs pulled from the market because of safety problems. From earlier in the article:
Only limited information on side effects was made public in the press release, but the companies said rates were similar between the placebo group and the treated group. An adverse event, or bad outcome, occurred in 35% of those who received molnupiravir and 40% of those who received placebo. Only 1.3% of molnupiravir-treated subjects discontinued the drug because of an adverse event, compared to 3.4% who discontinued placebo.
Pyrrho
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Re: Ivermectin study questioned

Post by Pyrrho »

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-58170809
The BBC can reveal that more than a third of 26 major trials of the drug for use on Covid have serious errors or signs of potential fraud. None of the rest show convincing evidence of ivermectin's effectiveness.

Dr Kyle Sheldrick, one of the group investigating the studies, said they had not found "a single clinical trial" claiming to show that ivermectin prevented Covid deaths that did not contain "either obvious signs of fabrication or errors so critical they invalidate the study".

Major problems included:

The same patient data being used multiple times for supposedly different people
Evidence that selection of patients for test groups was not random
Numbers unlikely to occur naturally
Percentages calculated incorrectly
Local health bodies unaware of the studies
Anaxagoras
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Re: Ivermectin study questioned

Post by Anaxagoras »

Gorski, aka Orac:

https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/iverme ... verywhere/
Hotarubi
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Re: Ivermectin study questioned

Post by Hotarubi »

xouper wrote: Mon Sep 20, 2021 3:52 pm
  • Heavily vaccinated state accounts for 65% of India’s COVID cases after rejecting ivermectin
    https://www.theblaze.com/op-ed/horowitz ... ivermectin
    The Indian state of Kerala has 3% of India's population, and 67% of its inhabitants have at least one vaccination. One would expect Kerala's COVID cases to be so low as to be invisible in a chart of India's very low overall cases. Yet this state of just 33 million people accounted for 65% of all of India's cases on Thursday, and even more in recent weeks. It has essentially been the only state experiencing a surge in recent months. It also happens to be the Indian state that has rejected ivermectin.
Must be fake news. Everyone knows ivermectin isn't effective for treating covid. Right?
Doctor X
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Re: Ivermectin study questioned

Post by Doctor X »

The first sentence he quotes dashes his claims.

I would deem that "ironic" if it was not him living up to his own negative stereotype.

– J.D.
Pyrrho
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Re: Ivermectin study questioned

Post by Pyrrho »

From September, an article which indicates that multiple factors are involved, ivermectin or no ivermectin:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/ ... e-of-covid
Dr Rajeev Jayadevan, vice-chairman of the Kerala State Indian medical association, said it was important to emphasise that Kerala’s trajectory of Covid had always differed from the rest of the country.

“When India was going through its first peak in June last year, there was hardly a bump here. Cases climbed a few months later in October, but even then came down quite quickly after government measures, so very few were infected” said Jayadevan.

“It meant when Delta arrived in Kerala in May, it found a very fertile place to spread, particularly after the lockdown was lifted. That’s why we’ve seen these case numbers. But I would describe the situation here as a slow burn, rather than an inferno.”

Jayadevan said it was inaccurate to characterise the current Covid wave in Kerala as a failure of the Kerala model, either in practice or implementation. Instead, he pointed to Kerala’s high population density – which is more than twice the national average as well as humid weather conditions, a number of religious festivals and gatherings that had occurred and fatigue among frontline healthcare workers responsible for community surveillance and contact tracing as other significant reasons for the ongoing circulation of the virus.
and
Kerala’s hospitalisation rate for Covid is 3%, compared with 5% nationwide when the second wave was at its worst. The state also has the highest uptake of vaccinations, with 55% of the population having had one vaccine, compared with 48% nationwide.

The death rate in Kerala also remains the lowest in India, at 0.5% compared with the national average of 1.4%. The Kerala state government has stood by their Covid strategy. “We do have a different model and our fatality rate shows our model is on the right track,” Kerala health minister Veena George told Reuters last month.
Official Kerala COVID-19 pages:

https://dashboard.kerala.gov.in/covid/index.php
Hotarubi
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Re: Ivermectin study questioned

Post by Hotarubi »

Doctor X wrote: Sun Oct 17, 2021 1:31 pm The first sentence he quotes dashes his claims.

I would deem that "ironic" if it was not him living up to his own negative stereotype.

– J.D.
Stop being uncivil.
Hotarubi
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Re: Ivermectin study questioned

Post by Hotarubi »

Pyrrho wrote: Sun Oct 17, 2021 2:51 pm From September, an article which indicates that multiple factors are involved, ivermectin or no ivermectin:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/ ... e-of-covid
Dr Rajeev Jayadevan, vice-chairman of the Kerala State Indian medical association, said it was important to emphasise that Kerala’s trajectory of Covid had always differed from the rest of the country.

“When India was going through its first peak in June last year, there was hardly a bump here. Cases climbed a few months later in October, but even then came down quite quickly after government measures, so very few were infected” said Jayadevan.

“It meant when Delta arrived in Kerala in May, it found a very fertile place to spread, particularly after the lockdown was lifted. That’s why we’ve seen these case numbers. But I would describe the situation here as a slow burn, rather than an inferno.”

Jayadevan said it was inaccurate to characterise the current Covid wave in Kerala as a failure of the Kerala model, either in practice or implementation. Instead, he pointed to Kerala’s high population density – which is more than twice the national average as well as humid weather conditions, a number of religious festivals and gatherings that had occurred and fatigue among frontline healthcare workers responsible for community surveillance and contact tracing as other significant reasons for the ongoing circulation of the virus.
and
Kerala’s hospitalisation rate for Covid is 3%, compared with 5% nationwide when the second wave was at its worst. The state also has the highest uptake of vaccinations, with 55% of the population having had one vaccine, compared with 48% nationwide.

The death rate in Kerala also remains the lowest in India, at 0.5% compared with the national average of 1.4%. The Kerala state government has stood by their Covid strategy. “We do have a different model and our fatality rate shows our model is on the right track,” Kerala health minister Veena George told Reuters last month.
Official Kerala COVID-19 pages:

https://dashboard.kerala.gov.in/covid/index.php
Mop on standby
xouper
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Re: Ivermectin study questioned

Post by xouper »

Pyrrho wrote: Sun Oct 17, 2021 2:51 pm From September, an article which indicates that multiple factors are involved, ivermectin or no ivermectin:
Spoiler:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/ ... e-of-covid
Dr Rajeev Jayadevan, vice-chairman of the Kerala State Indian medical association, said it was important to emphasise that Kerala’s trajectory of Covid had always differed from the rest of the country.

“When India was going through its first peak in June last year, there was hardly a bump here. Cases climbed a few months later in October, but even then came down quite quickly after government measures, so very few were infected” said Jayadevan.

“It meant when Delta arrived in Kerala in May, it found a very fertile place to spread, particularly after the lockdown was lifted. That’s why we’ve seen these case numbers. But I would describe the situation here as a slow burn, rather than an inferno.”

Jayadevan said it was inaccurate to characterise the current Covid wave in Kerala as a failure of the Kerala model, either in practice or implementation. Instead, he pointed to Kerala’s high population density – which is more than twice the national average as well as humid weather conditions, a number of religious festivals and gatherings that had occurred and fatigue among frontline healthcare workers responsible for community surveillance and contact tracing as other significant reasons for the ongoing circulation of the virus.
and
Kerala’s hospitalisation rate for Covid is 3%, compared with 5% nationwide when the second wave was at its worst. The state also has the highest uptake of vaccinations, with 55% of the population having had one vaccine, compared with 48% nationwide.

The death rate in Kerala also remains the lowest in India, at 0.5% compared with the national average of 1.4%. The Kerala state government has stood by their Covid strategy. “We do have a different model and our fatality rate shows our model is on the right track,” Kerala health minister Veena George told Reuters last month.
Official Kerala COVID-19 pages:

https://dashboard.kerala.gov.in/covid/index.php
Thanks for posting that.

I appreciate having more than one viewpoint to consider when deciding whom to believe.
Doctor X
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Re: Ivermectin study questioned

Post by Doctor X »

https://usa.ungerglobal.com/wp-content/ ... er-mop.jpg

– J.D.
xouper
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Re: Ivermectin study questioned

Post by xouper »

That kind of uncivil behavior does not contribute anything useful to the conversation. In fact all it does is reflect badly on you.
Doctor X
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Re: Ivermectin study questioned

Post by Doctor X »

https://www.kroger.com/product/images/l ... 3600038532

– J.D.
Hotarubi
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Re: Ivermectin study questioned

Post by Hotarubi »

Doctor X wrote: Sun Oct 17, 2021 9:27 pm https://usa.ungerglobal.com/wp-content/ ... er-mop.jpg

– J.D.
You wanker! I had this on standby:

https://i.ibb.co/jMh0VF8/Cleaning-lady-showing-warning-sign-because-the-floor-is-wet-and-there-is-danger-of-accidents.jpg
Doctor X
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Re: Ivermectin study questioned

Post by Doctor X »

You are welcome.

– J.D.
Hotarubi
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Re: Ivermectin study questioned

Post by Hotarubi »

Mine's funnier .
Doctor X
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Re: Ivermectin study questioned

Post by Doctor X »

Keep it in your pants, son.

– J.D.
sparks
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Re: Ivermectin study questioned

Post by sparks »

It's all Comedy Gold! :-)
Hotarubi
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Re: Ivermectin study questioned

Post by Hotarubi »

sparks wrote: Mon Oct 18, 2021 2:10 am It's all Comedy Gold! :-)
Funniest of all is xouper thanking pyrrho for posting data that humiliates her.
Doctor X
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Re: Ivermectin study questioned

Post by Doctor X »

Might have helped if he had read it a few pages ago.

Or even searched the topic before trying to proselytize his beliefs about it.

You know, the decent thing.

– J.D.