The futility of arguing about science

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robinson
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The futility of arguing about science

Post by robinson »

As the Moon moves around the Earth, it creates a bulge of water on the Earth's surface which follows its movements. A corresponding bulge appears on the opposite side of the Earth, thanks to the centrifugal forces generated by the Earth's rotation.

https://www.allthingsnature.org/how-do- ... s-work.htm

Not one part of that is true
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Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by robinson »

The Earth rotates on its axis in just under 24 hours, whereas the Moon takes 27.5 days to complete an orbit of the Earth. Because the Earth rotates on its axis faster than the Moon revolves around the Earth, the tidal bulge is always a little bit ahead of the Moon.

https://explainingscience.org/2020/06/0 ... ides-work/


That is not correct either. There is no tidal bulge, much less two of them.
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Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by robinson »

One thing that is certain, there are a lot of scientific pages on the internet, that are wrong about the ocean tides.

And arguing with experts about being wrong about the tides is futile.
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Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by xouper »

Image

More here: https://xoup.net/humor/reasoning-with-idiots/
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Re: The futility of arguing about science

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The only way to win is to not argue
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Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by robinson »

Ha! That’s the essential message of that link

(I posted before I read it)
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Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by robinson »

I like the story about Jack
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Re: The futility of arguing about science

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Bah!
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Re: The futility of arguing about science

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:bigthumb:
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Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by robinson »

robinson wrote: Wed Jul 07, 2021 5:37 am Here's the really obvious and annoying ones.

All of the following is just not true.

There are two tides a day, because there is a bulge on the other side of the earth from the bulge under the moon.
This one is especially annoying because there are two different wrong explanations. And the pages that explain why one of them is wrong, they are using the other wrong reasoning, which is pretty fucking amusing, but also annoying, to a scientist.

Ocean tides are very complex, and that is an understatement. Most freshman-level textbooks ignore the subject entirely. Even some advanced undergraduate level mechanics texts don't get into it, which is a good move. No seriously, it's the best move.

The "explanings" that debunk the rotation of the earth as a cause then go on to explain it with even worse explainings.
In the discussion about what
causes the two bulges of water you
must completely ignore the rotation
of the Earth on its axis
https://noc.ac.uk/files/documents/busin ... nation.pdf

So we get the following
The gravitational attraction between the Earth and the moon is strongest on the side of the Earth that happens to be facing the moon, simply because it is closer. This attraction causes the water on this “near side” of Earth to be pulled toward the moon. As gravitational force acts to draw the water closer to the moon, inertia attempts to keep the water in place. But the gravitational force exceeds it and the water is pulled toward the moon, causing a “bulge” of water on the near side toward the moon
https://oceanservice.noaa.gov/education ... avity.html

And of course there are all the images used, showing twin bulges (which do not exist)

Image

Every skeptical student that is subjected to this quite rightly sees a problem, the second bulge. I mean, most can understand the bulge under the moon (which does not exist), but the one on the other side seems impossible (it is)

No matter, experts and authorities blindly teach it as fact, because somebody told them it was, and it's complete bullshit. Not just a little, complete bullshit. Then it gets worse.
This pair of bulges is the Earth’s twin high tides, and they stay put, aligned with the Moon – it is the Earth and ocean rotating beneath them that causes the ocean to rise and fall twice a day in any given place.

It’s not just the Moon that pulls on our oceans. The Sun’s gravity affects our tides, too. For the same reasons given above it creates two bulges with an effect half as strong as that of the Moon.
https://cosmosmagazine.com/geoscience/w ... tides-day/

Now there are four bulges. Fucking madness.

To make it even worse, oh so much worse, the solid earth is does deform like the diagrams showing the oceans. But the ocean loading (the weight of the water) is much greater than the solid earth tide, and at this point what actually happens is so complicated, we are back to "advanced undergraduate level mechanics texts don't get into it"

And because the bulges are imagined to exist, other experts teach the bulges are either ahead of, or behind the moon (imagining the moon is directly over the bulge), with more explainings about why that happens.

Arguing about almost every bit of this is futile.
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Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by robinson »

If you read all that, then you are fucking awesome. If you understand it, you are a fucking genius. No seriously. The vast majority of the humans alive quite simply don't give a single fuck, and never will.
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Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by Fid »

Billo had a tough time with that too. You're in good company.
... The stars were suns, but so far away they were just little points of light ... The scale of the universe suddenly opened up to me. It was a kind of religious experience. There was a magnificence to it, a grandeur, a scale which has never left me. Never ever left me.
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Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by robinson »

What the ocean tides actually look like is quite fascinating
still working on Sophrosyne, but I will no doubt end up with Hubris