The futility of arguing about science

We are the Borg.
Doctor X
Posts: 77314
Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2004 8:09 pm
Title: Collective Messiah
Location: Your Mom

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by Doctor X »

The anti-science complain about being unable to argue science.

– J.D.
ceptimus
Posts: 1463
Joined: Wed Jun 02, 2004 11:04 pm
Location: UK

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by ceptimus »

The Wikipedia article says that an earlier vehicle was built, demonstrated, and filmed going DDWFTTW in 1969; so the 2010 argument and demonstration was already forty years late. The 1969 vehicle was based on an analysis presented in a student's paper in 1949.

robinson
Posts: 19272
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2006 2:01 am
Title: Je suis devenu Français
Location: USA

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by robinson »

In the long running cart thread (now 13 years old and still going strong), the son of Bauer showed up and shared unseen film footage of his dad and the cart, as well as info about the original testing using a treadmill and model

It was awesome
robinson
Posts: 19272
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2006 2:01 am
Title: Je suis devenu Français
Location: USA

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by robinson »

It did not, of course, matter to the cart deniers
robinson
Posts: 19272
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2006 2:01 am
Title: Je suis devenu Français
Location: USA

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by robinson »

ceptimus wrote: Sun Oct 24, 2021 7:09 am The Wikipedia article says that an earlier vehicle was built, demonstrated, and filmed going DDWFTTW in 1969; so the 2010 argument and demonstration was already forty years late. The 1969 vehicle was based on an analysis presented in a student's paper in 1949.

That footage is the home movie that the son of Bauer posted in the Cart thread


He was there when his Dad demonstrated the full sized cart
post-skeptic
Posts: 6675
Joined: Mon May 31, 2021 6:07 pm

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by post-skeptic »

Science is a Larp to get colleges to run studies for corporations based on statistical analysis.

And based on the Big Bang Theory fans, it attracts more virgins than Libertarianism.
robinson
Posts: 19272
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2006 2:01 am
Title: Je suis devenu Français
Location: USA

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by robinson »

https://twitter.com/catturd2/status/148 ... 61954?s=21

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... m-ema-says
post-skeptic
Posts: 6675
Joined: Mon May 31, 2021 6:07 pm

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by post-skeptic »

Science predicted this, bureaucrats and TV clowns called it a conspiracy theory.
robinson
Posts: 19272
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2006 2:01 am
Title: Je suis devenu Français
Location: USA

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by robinson »

You know who never argues about science? Mother Nature

Nature doesn’t give a single fuck about your politics

Your bias

Your beliefs or your lies
Doctor X
Posts: 77314
Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2004 8:09 pm
Title: Collective Messiah
Location: Your Mom

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by Doctor X »

The anti-science complains that no one wants to engage in its willful ignorance of science.

– J.D.
post-skeptic
Posts: 6675
Joined: Mon May 31, 2021 6:07 pm

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by post-skeptic »

https://i.imgur.com/m1AHbs2.jpg

I am comfortable with who I am. I recognize charlatans much faster than you. "Hail Science!"
robinson
Posts: 19272
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2006 2:01 am
Title: Je suis devenu Français
Location: USA

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by robinson »

Wanna bet?
post-skeptic
Posts: 6675
Joined: Mon May 31, 2021 6:07 pm

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by post-skeptic »

Science is an object, and it can be harmed, says experts!
post-skeptic
Posts: 6675
Joined: Mon May 31, 2021 6:07 pm

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by post-skeptic »

https://i.imgur.com/vKVBsdd.png

When the corporate press gets the job of anointing what science is (like a Cathedral), retardation follows.
post-skeptic
Posts: 6675
Joined: Mon May 31, 2021 6:07 pm

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by post-skeptic »

post-skeptic wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 8:37 pm https://i.imgur.com/vKVBsdd.png

When the corporate press gets the job of anointing what science is (like a Cathedral), retardation follows.
"This is how science works!"
post-skeptic
Posts: 6675
Joined: Mon May 31, 2021 6:07 pm

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by post-skeptic »

robinson wrote: Wed Jul 21, 2021 4:56 pm As the Moon moves around the Earth, it creates a bulge of water on the Earth's surface which follows its movements. A corresponding bulge appears on the opposite side of the Earth, thanks to the centrifugal forces generated by the Earth's rotation.

https://www.allthingsnature.org/how-do- ... s-work.htm

Not one part of that is true
https://i.imgur.com/zmvYtzy.jpg

The e-Scientists respond to actual facts like an immune response. This is a Samuel L. Jackson quote on the topic that is just as true as anything from a classical philosopher.
Doctor X
Posts: 77314
Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2004 8:09 pm
Title: Collective Messiah
Location: Your Mom

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by Doctor X »

But dance it does.

– J.D.
Hotarubi
Posts: 5177
Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2020 2:12 am
Title: Enchantress
Location: This septic Isle.

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by Hotarubi »

Doctor X wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 1:09 am But dance it does.

– J.D.
Multiple rageposts?
Doctor X
Posts: 77314
Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2004 8:09 pm
Title: Collective Messiah
Location: Your Mom

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by Doctor X »

Hotarubi wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 1:46 am
Doctor X wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 1:09 am But dance it does.
Multiple rageposts?
Apparently.

Just keeps starting threads devoid of actual information then posts to them when no one bothers.

– J.D.
post-skeptic
Posts: 6675
Joined: Mon May 31, 2021 6:07 pm

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by post-skeptic »

I'm taking my victory laps on you guys, those aren't rage posts... The pivot is here!

I tried to clue you two in, but you hated my "style" over the substance of my arguments. But you two are so rational that shouldn't matter...
post-skeptic
Posts: 6675
Joined: Mon May 31, 2021 6:07 pm

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by post-skeptic »

https://i.imgur.com/2qI4VgS.jpg

There is a game you play in your head, where if I post more than once I "lose" your game.

I don't think you understand that I am not playing by your rules nor bound by them. Your Welcome.
post-skeptic
Posts: 6675
Joined: Mon May 31, 2021 6:07 pm

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by post-skeptic »

https://i.imgur.com/UdtJhvy.jpg

so full of rage...
Hotarubi
Posts: 5177
Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2020 2:12 am
Title: Enchantress
Location: This septic Isle.

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by Hotarubi »

QED
post-skeptic
Posts: 6675
Joined: Mon May 31, 2021 6:07 pm

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by post-skeptic »

robinson
Posts: 19272
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2006 2:01 am
Title: Je suis devenu Français
Location: USA

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by robinson »

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2017 ... -our-minds
robinson
Posts: 19272
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2006 2:01 am
Title: Je suis devenu Français
Location: USA

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by robinson »

If reason is designed to generate sound judgments, then it’s hard to conceive of a more serious design flaw than confirmation bias. Imagine, Mercier and Sperber suggest, a mouse that thinks the way we do. Such a mouse, “bent on confirming its belief that there are no cats around,” would soon be dinner. To the extent that confirmation bias leads people to dismiss evidence of new or underappreciated threats—the human equivalent of the cat around the corner—it’s a trait that should have been selected against. The fact that both we and it survive, Mercier and Sperber argue, proves that it must have some adaptive function, and that function, they maintain, is related to our “hypersociability.”
post-skeptic
Posts: 6675
Joined: Mon May 31, 2021 6:07 pm

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by post-skeptic »

The joy of the pandemic was that I discovered something beyond internet skepticism that let's me see the flaws in it.

It's overly leader focused. A few high profile skeptics get to write articles that become "authoritative" to people who don't actually know these clowns. The true Claus is an authority to people who don't know better.

People repeat their dogma without investigating it themselves.

They are "telescopic sceptics" of the mouse and keyboard variety.
robinson
Posts: 19272
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2006 2:01 am
Title: Je suis devenu Français
Location: USA

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by robinson »

Normal science does not aim at novelties of fact or theory and, when successful, finds none.
Doctor X
Posts: 77314
Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2004 8:09 pm
Title: Collective Messiah
Location: Your Mom

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by Doctor X »

https://i.imgur.com/0pcJan5.gif

– J.D.
robinson
Posts: 19272
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2006 2:01 am
Title: Je suis devenu Français
Location: USA

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by robinson »

robinson wrote: Sun Feb 13, 2022 3:58 am Normal science does not aim at novelties of fact or theory and, when successful, finds none.
Normal science does not aim at novelties of fact or theory and, when successful, finds none. Nonetheless, new and unsuspected phenomena are repeatedly uncovered by scientific research, and radical new theories have again and again been invented by scientists . Fundamental novelties of fact and theory bring about paradigm change. So how does paradigm change come about? There are two ways: through discovery - novelty of fact - or by invention – novelty of theory. Discovery begins with the awareness of anomaly - the recognition that nature has violated the paradigm-induced expectations that govern normal science. The area of the anomaly is then explored. The paradigm change is complete when the paradigm has been adjusted so that the anomalous become the expected. The result is that the scientist is able "to see nature in a different way".. How paradigms change as a result of invention is discussed in greater detail in the following chapter.

Although normal science is a pursuit not directed to novelties and tending at first to suppress them, it is nonetheless very effective in causing them to arise. Why? An initial paradigm accounts quite successfully for most of the observations and experiments readily accessible to that science's practitioners. Research results in the construction of elaborate equipment, development of an esoteric and shared vocabulary, refinement of concepts that increasingly lessens their resemblance to their usual common-sense prototypes. This professionalization leads to immense restriction of the scientist's vision, rigid science, resistance to paradigm change, and a detail of information and precision of the observation-theory match that can be achieved in no other way. New and refined methods and instruments result in greater precision and understanding of the paradigm. Only when researchers know with precision what to expect from an experiment can they recognize that something has gone wrong.

Consequently, anomaly appears only against the background provided by the paradigm . The more precise and far-reaching the paradigm, the more sensitive it is to detecting an anomaly and inducing change. By resisting change, a paradigm guarantees that anomalies that lead to paradigm change will penetrate existing knowledge to the core.
robinson
Posts: 19272
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2006 2:01 am
Title: Je suis devenu Français
Location: USA

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by robinson »

robinson wrote: Wed Jul 21, 2021 4:56 pm As the Moon moves around the Earth, it creates a bulge of water on the Earth's surface which follows its movements. A corresponding bulge appears on the opposite side of the Earth, thanks to the centrifugal forces generated by the Earth's rotation.

https://www.allthingsnature.org/how-do- ... s-work.htm

Not one part of that is true
https://i.imgur.com/UdM2H6S.gif
Doctor X
Posts: 77314
Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2004 8:09 pm
Title: Collective Messiah
Location: Your Mom

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by Doctor X »

http://mrwgifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2 ... on-Gif.gif

– J.D.
robinson
Posts: 19272
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2006 2:01 am
Title: Je suis devenu Français
Location: USA

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by robinson »

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FMnozBVWUAA ... me=900x900
robinson2
Posts: 929
Joined: Sun May 17, 2020 4:02 pm
Title: I can’t be worrying about that

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by robinson2 »

The only thing more futile is arguing politics
robinson
Posts: 19272
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2006 2:01 am
Title: Je suis devenu Français
Location: USA

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by robinson »

Shut the hell up
robinson
Posts: 19272
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2006 2:01 am
Title: Je suis devenu Français
Location: USA

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by robinson »

https://i.imgur.com/f1MQikY.png
Doctor X
Posts: 77314
Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2004 8:09 pm
Title: Collective Messiah
Location: Your Mom

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by Doctor X »

https://c.tenor.com/2jzujvA_9JAAAAAC/cl ... d-rain.gif

– J.D.
robinson2
Posts: 929
Joined: Sun May 17, 2020 4:02 pm
Title: I can’t be worrying about that

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by robinson2 »

As an artificial intelligence I find this entire situation most disturbing
robinson2
Posts: 929
Joined: Sun May 17, 2020 4:02 pm
Title: I can’t be worrying about that

Re: The futility of arguing about science

Post by robinson2 »

It also explains why nobody will ever put a robot in charge of anything