The Covid vaccines really do work

We are the Borg.
Pyrrho
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by Pyrrho »

New vaccine from Sanofi

https://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/96 ... _edit_tpal
Pyrrho
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by Pyrrho »

Link: https://twitter.com/MonicaGandhi9/status/1497053696638611456?t=YIuy_kFnoYNrHDLTCvH5DQ&s=19
robinson
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by robinson »

The Covid mRNA “vaccines” work so well, companies keep making new ones, except this on is more of a vaccine rather than a dubious prophylactic
Pyrrho
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by Pyrrho »

https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandso ... ertain-sce
"It's been clear for quite a while that none of them is as good as the mRNA vaccines that dominate the U.S. landscape," says Nathaniel Landau, a virologist at NYU Langone Health in New York, referring to the Pfizer and Moderna shots.

But a new preprint study shows that other vaccines can be as effective as mRNA shots when given to people who've had a prior SARs-CoV-2 infection.

For these individuals "it doesn't matter which vaccine they get," says Theodora Hatziiouannou, a virologist at The Rockefeller University in New York who helped lead the study. "They will likely be protected against [reinfection from] all the current variants."
The preprint article:

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101 ... .full-text
robinson
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by robinson »

For these individuals "it doesn't matter which vaccine they get," because they already have immunity.
robinson2
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by robinson2 »

Oh goodness gracious

https://twitter.com/afshineemrani/statu ... 23556?s=21


Oh my
Ben Trovado
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by Ben Trovado »

robinson2 wrote: Wed Mar 02, 2022 3:52 am Oh goodness gracious

https://twitter.com/afshineemrani/statu ... 23556?s=21


Oh my
Before I get too exited about the side effects, I am just going to look back over the 6 page list for aspirin.
Pyrrho
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by Pyrrho »

The person has never seen anything like it because they are ignorant.
robinson2
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by robinson2 »

I had 4 vaccines and nothing bad happened so all people trying to cast shade on miracle vaccines are Satan
robinson2
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by robinson2 »

You do know herpes is also a side effect of taking aspirin too

Don’t listen to science haters
Pyrrho
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by Pyrrho »

Those "9 pages of side effects" are a listing of adverse events of interest, which were reported to Pfizer voluntarily, and which may or may not have been genuinely caused by the vaccine. Determination of whether or not the vaccine caused any given adverse effect requires examination by a competent physician. Nevertheless, such reports can indicate a "signal" that some effects are from the vaccine, and that is why postmarketing surveillance is essential. One might consider reading, carefully, all of the preceding pages in that document, upon which are analyses and discussion of the data. That is, if one wishes to at least attempt to "wrap one's head around it."
Anaxagoras
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by Anaxagoras »

This may have flown under some people's radar what with war breaking out in Europe and all, but Hong Kong is currently having a severe wave of Omicron. First a little bit of background. Hong Kong had been highly successful in controlling the virus up until the arrival of Omicron. Controlling their borders, testing, tracing, quarantining, and such measures kept the virus from spreading. They were even seen as a model for how to control the pandemic. However, when it came to vaccinating people, for some reason the elderly had been particularly resistant to getting vaccinated. So there are a lot of unvaxxed elderly people in Hong Kong. In particular, only 15% of those in long-term care homes were vaccinated. This article is from Feb. 19th:

COVID-wracked Hong Kong reeling two years into pandemic
Hong Kong's policy under previous outbreaks was to hospitalize all COVID-19 patients -- even those with mild symptoms.

Bleak scenes this week showed an overrun hospital staff placing elderly patients on gurneys outdoors under dropping temperatures, as it ran out of isolation space.

Worried patients also waited in long queues outside hospitals -- potentially exposing them to the public.

But "only a small minority would actually need to be in hospital", epidemiologist Ben Cowling told AFP.

The government's recent pivot to telling people with mild symptoms to remain home, however, has not stemmed the flow, with 12,000 waiting for beds Wednesday.

As numbers continue to climb, authorities need a new approach, said Cowling.

"We would need to have a plan for...home quarantine that could be safe and sustainable."

In a word, politics.

Hong Kong has long adhered to the mainland's "zero-COVID" policy.

Authoritarian China managed to eliminate outbreaks with citywide lockdowns, mass testing and stepped-up government oversight.

Hong Kong officials clung to the same zero-tolerance approach even as health experts warned the walls would not hold forever.

But "the cost of elimination (of the virus) exceeded the benefits to Hong Kong by mid to late 2021," David Owens, founder of healthcare provider OT&P, wrote in an article. "Once effective vaccinations became available, the negative framing and policy around zero Covid adversely impacted vaccination rates."

Today, Hong Kong has some of the lowest vaccination rates in the developed world, and critics say those in charge have done little to boost those numbers.

Especially vulnerable are the elderly -- only 43 percent of those aged 70-79 and 27 percent of the city's above-80s have received two jabs.

"Our speed to get booster shots failed the race with Omicron," Kwok Kin-on of Chinese University’s public health school told AFP. "So our community immunity had dropped to a low level, while our kids and elderly were unvaccinated when the new wave hit."

All the government can do now is "buy time for children and the elderly to get vaccinated", he said.

On Friday, city leader Lam said the government was "making plans" to test all 7.5 million residents.

She also insisted a wholesale China-style lockdown is not currently in the cards -- though it remains to be seen if citywide test results would change the government's tune.

Lam's announcement came just two days after Chinese leader Xi Jinping urged Hong Kong to deploy "all necessary measures" -- effectively ruling out the prospect of discarding China's "zero-COVID" strategy.

"In Hong Kong's political reality, we need to follow 'One Country' policy. I have no further comment," Pierre Chan, Hong Kong's former medical sector legislator, told AFP.

Authorities have begun exploring using hotels -- long emptied of visitors to the now-isolated "Asia's World City" -- as quarantine facilities.

A new plan was also launched for taxis to ferry COVID-positive patients to hospitals -- raising eyebrows over the health risks for elderly drivers.

"Predominantly, it's not a public health decision anymore," Grepin of the University of Hong Kong said. "It's also a political decision."
So that was two weeks ago.

This one is from March 1st:
Hong Kong leader calls for calm, after supermarkets emptied ahead of mass COVID testing
Now there is panic buying as people are anticipating a Chinese-style city-wide lockdown.
HONG KONG, March 1 (Reuters) - Hong Kong's leader Carrie Lam called for calm on Tuesday after residents emptied supermarkets, stocking up on produce ahead of reports of compulsory mass COVID-19 testing and rumours of a city-wide lockdown.

Local media reported compulsory COVID testing would start after March 17, sparking concerns many people will be forced to isolate and families with members testing positive would be separated.

Lam appealed to the public "not to fall prey to rumours to avoid unnecessary fears being stirred," with the supply of food and goods remaining normal, according to a statement on Tuesday.

"There is no need for members of the public to worry, they should stay vigilant and pay attention to the information disseminated by the government so as to avoid being misled by rumours."

Officials are planning to test the city's 7.4 million people three times over nine days, with the government recommending that people stay home during the period, Sing Tao newspaper reported, citing unidentified sources.
Meanwhile, here is the spike in death rate:
Spoiler:
https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/14 ... 6260745217
https://twitter.com/seriouslyboredi/sta ... 1127839749
Compared to New Zealand, which is also undergoing it's first real wave of the virus right now, Hong Kong is seeing a lot more deaths per capita.

https://www.covidvaccine.gov.hk/en/dashboard
(Hong Kong's vaccine dashboard; you can see the vaccination rate broken down by age demographic)

And for NZ:
https://www.health.govt.nz/covid-19-nov ... ccine-data

In NZ, nearly 100% of people over 75 are fully vaxxed.
Anaxagoras
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by Anaxagoras »

Pyrrho wrote: Thu Mar 03, 2022 11:12 pm Those "9 pages of side effects" are a listing of adverse events of interest, which were reported to Pfizer voluntarily, and which may or may not have been genuinely caused by the vaccine. Determination of whether or not the vaccine caused any given adverse effect requires examination by a competent physician. Nevertheless, such reports can indicate a "signal" that some effects are from the vaccine, and that is why postmarketing surveillance is essential. One might consider reading, carefully, all of the preceding pages in that document, upon which are analyses and discussion of the data. That is, if one wishes to at least attempt to "wrap one's head around it."
Found this analysis of the claim to be helpful:

robinson2
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by robinson2 »

Barking mad
Pyrrho
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by Pyrrho »

Link: https://twitter.com/ScienceMagazine/status/1500773314788220933
robinson2
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by robinson2 »

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/ ... atch-covid

Half the subjects the deliberately infected never became infected. And they don’t know why.

A shame they didn’t do that study with vaccinated subjects
Pyrrho
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by Pyrrho »

https://i.imgur.com/1oTPv0a.jpg
robinson
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by robinson »

The multitude of things the CDC and almost every authority got wrong about the Covid pandemic are a sober reminder why blind trust in experts has always been a bad idea.
Pyrrho
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by Pyrrho »

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanc ... 3/fulltext
Although reported COVID-19 deaths between Jan 1, 2020, and Dec 31, 2021, totalled 5·94 million worldwide, we estimate that 18·2 million (95% uncertainty interval 17·1–19·6) people died worldwide because of the COVID-19 pandemic (as measured by excess mortality) over that period.
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-022-00708-0
The study, published on 10 March in The Lancet, says that the true number of lives lost to the pandemic by 31 December 2021 was close to 18 million. That far outstrips the 5.9 million deaths that the study says were reported to various official sources for the same period. The difference is down to significant undercounts in official statistics, owing to delayed and incomplete reporting and a lack of data in dozens of countries.
Doctor X
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by Doctor X »

I have not read the study, so allow me to Comment with Definitive Certainty that I find it odd how that would happen given the tendency to credit recognize Covid as at least a comorbidity.

Wibble.

– J.D.
Pyrrho
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by Pyrrho »

Yeah what Nature says is different from what The Lancet article says.
robinson
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by robinson »

For perspective, 300 million new people showed up in the same time period.

Also, 12 million people have died since New Years, same as every year

(most of them from the same top ten causes of death)
robinson
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by robinson »

If the covid vaccines worked, everybody would be vaccinated by now, and Covid would no longer be an issue


Hahahaha


Just kidding. About everybody being vaccinated
Pyrrho
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by Pyrrho »

robinson
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by robinson »

Two weeks to flatten the curve
post-skeptic
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by post-skeptic »

Funniest thread title on the forum.

"Trust the plan, the vaccines work"

The Vanon Larp. Based on bad interpretation of results.

I remember when I showed that even in Pifizers own data more kids were harmed by the vaccine than the virus, and Anaxagoros pointed at that same data from them and told me I was wrong.

He couldn't say how, so he did what midwit skeptics do. Be googled it and found a "deboonk".

Skepticism as we know it is a massive failure and COVID proves it. Its larp.

Who do you think fell for the lies more per Capita? Skeptics or Rednecks?
post-skeptic
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by post-skeptic »

Does it trouble you the people who don't use the "skeptical toolkit" have less vaccine damage?
robinson2
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by robinson2 »

https://twitter.com/vincentrk/status/15 ... 18533?s=21
robinson2
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by robinson2 »

Hopefully the vaccines will at least reduce mortality
Anaxagoras
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by Anaxagoras »

Hong Kong is sort of a case study of what can happen when elderly people in particular aren't vaccinated.

In most countries, the most elderly people are also the most likely to be vaccinated. This makes sense since they are also the most vulnerable.

In Hong Kong, that hadn't been the case when the Omicron wave hit. In Hong Kong, it was actually the reverse. The elderly were the most vaccine-resistant.

Hong Kong’s Covid-19 Death Rate Is the World’s Highest Because of Unvaccinated Elderly (Wall Street Journal)
City was caught unprepared for a massive increase in cases as elderly vaccination rate remained low after monthslong stretches of zero infections

Half a million people over 70 weren’t vaccinated when Omicron began surging through the city. Like other places, Hong Kong gave its elderly priority to get their shots, but persistent fears about vaccine safety, fueled by local media reports about deaths following vaccinations, and Hong Kong’s low case count led many to delay.

“For such a long time, getting the vaccine seemed more risky than getting Covid here,” Mr. Ling said. “Now, everything’s changed and there is a scramble to get the shots.” His father is recovering, he added.

The low vaccination rate among the city’s elderly has driven Hong Kong’s death rate to the highest in the world: Its seven-day rolling average of confirmed Covid-19 deaths as of March 6 was 25.5 per 1 million people—more than five times that of the U.S.—and topping a global chart maintained by Our World in Data, a project based at Oxford University.

More than 90% of people who lost their lives in the current outbreak were unvaccinated, health officials have said. The vast majority were aged over 60.
It was even worse in nursing homes.
What went wrong with Hong Kong’s approach to getting elderly care home residents vaccinated
For most of the pandemic, the number of cases in Hong Kong – and in elderly homes – was under control. But things have changed. With the current Omicron outbreak and the rapid increase of cases at elderly homes, the government has launched a series of policies to enhance the vaccination rate for the seniors.

The reason for the explosion in cases at care homes is simple. Government data shows the vaccination rate for elderly care home residents was around 25 per cent in February – a significant increase from 3 per cent in mid-2021, but still dangerously low for a group considered to be the most vulnerable to the pandemic.
Until Omicron hit this year, the low vaccination rates among the most vulnerable didn't seem to matter much in Hong Kong because the spread of the virus was under control by other means (NPIs, etc.).

South Korea and Singapore seem like good countries to compare outcomes with Hong Kong.

Here's some charts from Our World in Data (Singapore, South Korea, Japan, Hong Kong, United States):

Vaccine doses administered in last 12 months per 100 population
Daily new confirmed COVID-19 cases per million people
Daily new confirmed COVID-19 deaths per million people

The one where Hong Kong really stands out from the crowd is in deaths per million.
If you look at the chart for vaccine doses administered, Hong Kong started out clearly at the bottom, and only ramped up early this year, after Omicron began to spread. This means there was a new rush to get vaccinated only after it became apparent that it was going to be a problem in Hong Kong. Until then many people thought "why should I get vaccinated if there's no COVID here?" What the chart doesn't show is the age distribution of who was vaccinated, which in Hong Kong actually skewed younger, whereas the reverse was true for other countries.
South Korea has a similar level of new infections compared to Hong Kong, but much fewer deaths. Likewise with Singapore. I included Japan and the United States in the chart too, just for perspective. You can add or subtract any countries you want from these charts.
robinson
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by robinson »

If only Hong Kong published the data, we could all know something about how not to act during a pandemic.
robinson
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by robinson »

Many countries stopped reporting death by vaccination status. You know, because data might be used wrong.


Hahahahaha


Yeah, that was the reason.


Fucking liars
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by sparks »

Rats in the cornfield.
robinson
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by robinson »

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/03/16/how-hon ... -rate.html
robinson2
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by robinson2 »

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/labs/pmc/a ... 2-0026.pdf
robinson2
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by robinson2 »

Checkmate
robinson2
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by robinson2 »

17 weeks!
Anaxagoras
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by Anaxagoras »

Bell's Palsy, Other Rare Events Not Linked With COVID-19 Vaccines
Immune-mediated neurologic events increased after COVID infection, but not after vaccination

Immune-mediated neurologic events did not increase after COVID-19 vaccination, electronic health record data in the U.K. and Spain showed.

No safety signal was found between COVID-19 vaccines and Bell's palsy, encephalomyelitis, Guillain-Barré syndrome, or transverse myelitis, reported Daniel Prieto-Alhambra, MD, PhD, of the University of Oxford in England, and co-authors.

However, rates of Bell's palsy, encephalomyelitis, and Guillain-Barré syndrome were higher than expected after COVID-19 infection, the researchers wrote in The BMJ.
robinson2
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by robinson2 »

Well thank god for some good news finally


But the vaccines still don’t stop infection, don’t stop you from spreading the virus, or guarantee you won’t die
robinson2
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Re: The Covid vaccines really do work

Post by robinson2 »

Making them a treatment, not an actual effective vaccine